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Anybody have any experience or comments about using plastic wire-bundle ties, instead of copper wire, for S&G stitching? I've seen a lot of mention on-line, mostly "oh, here's another idea", but I didn't get the feeling there was much experience out there with this trick. One downside would seem to be that you have to thread the tie thru from one side, then back from the other, since the little "buckle" will not pass thru the holes -- just that much more back and forth if you're working solo.

Also, has anybody tried the 3/4" dowel pieces for alignment blocks, as touted on the EPOXYWORKS site: www.westsystem.com/ewmag/18/dowels
They would seem to have the advantage of being very much "self-aligning".

Anybody in favor of adding another post forum for "Building Methods"? The current line-up gets pretty specific for epoxy, fasteners, etc. and I find the general building method advice gets buried in the details and is often harder to find. I had trouble deciding where to post today's questions so they'd be seen.

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I haven't tried the cable ties. My first reaction is that you would need to drill much larger holes.

My second reaction is that it is a cool idea. Your fingers get pretty raw working with the copper wires.

My third reaction is that the ties may work for some of the easier areas to join. In some of the areas that need tough bending/clamping, twisting the wires with pliers adds a lot of leverage to help with the pull. I don't know if you could get the same effect with the cable ties in those areas.

Here's a cool trick I was shown for cutting your copper wires...

Cut about 10 or 12 six foot lengths of the wire. Bunch them together side by side. Clamp one end in your bench vise. Pull tight. Give the other end of the bunch a quick twist with a pair of pliers, then chuck it in your drill. Wind the whole thing until you get about a 2" spiral. This new "Cable" can be cut to lengh easily, and each section will easily untwist to make 12 pre-cut ties.

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Bruce.

~~ Do what you love, and love what you do. ~~
~~ To me - only my boat is not yet perfect. Everybody else's is to be admired for I know the path they have walked (Dave Lott, 2010) ~~
Dow's Monaco Project

Thanks Bruce. I like the wire trick -- if I go with wires I'll try it.

I had thought about the "pull" capacity of the wire ties and the dilemma would be that to get more tension you need bigger ties, and thus bigger holes, etc., etc,!! They do make a tool for tensioning the ties, which sounds like it would save the wear on the fingers (maybe), but again, I don't know how much tension the tool develops. Think I might try the wire ties and keep a good supply of wire close by in case that ends up being a better choice.

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......SURE BEATS WORKIN' !!

I have some stainless tie wire,would this work instead of the copper tie wire for stitch and glue?

Probably a stupid ,obvious question,but ....

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Boat building can best be defined as an endless series of
tragedies obscured by the occasional miracle, followed by a good bottle of beer.

Don't Dream Your Life, Live Your Dream

I don't think bigger is necessarily better. I've seen cable ties that hare high tensile and tools that are made to pull them really, really tight. That could be a great solution.

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Isn't it amazing!! The person that never has the fortitude to pursue his own dreams, will be the first to try and discourage you from pursuing yours.

Also there are special pliers made for tying wires they actually lock the ends to be twisted then it is just a matter of pulling on the part of the pliers which makes the body of the pliers twist and tighten the wire. Maybe the hot rod guys can chime in here I know many ues it to secure fasteners. The aircraft guys also use them. They are designed to save fingers.

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Nice curves are easy on the eyes.
Go sell crazy somewhere else we're all stocked up here."As Good As It Gets" Jack Nicholson.

Yes they do...check with heating and air people. I just used one (the tool, I mean) when I installed some duct work in the new lake house. Simple, easy, and could work one-handed. It put a good amount of tension on the ties; maybe 30-40 lbs. Also, if you are careful, you can tighten without cutting the ties, re-adjust, tighten some more, then when you are ready just give the tool a good squeeze and it cuts the waste part of the tie off.

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Bill

I told my wife we needed a three-car garage for my projects...she told me to ask her for permission next time before I buy a house.
http://www.unitybuild.net

Great feedback............thanks folks!!

I'm about to give both options a try and will report back with my results.

I plan to also try the dowel trick, just to see how they work -- again, I'll let ya know.

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......SURE BEATS WORKIN' !!

I used the plastic cable ties for a kayak I built and also for some of the superstructure of the boat I am building.
There were some fairly tight bends in the kayak and I did not have any problem getting them tight enough by hand. In some cases I just started working along and going back over till the whole length was tight.
Working with a small(ish) area I did not have any problems feeding them through the holes. The real beauty is that you can bury the cable tie on the inside and then cut them off flush on the external surface, fill with thickened epoxy and sand smooth. No good if you want to clear finish, but perfect if you are painting.

Kevin

I've done it both ways. For me, the wire ties were easier and gave me a better mating surface. Sometimes with the really tight bends, I would break the zip ties. Also, if you need to force something into place, the rigidity of the copper wire holds the panels better.

It is only my 2 cents. But I only use wire for stitch-n-glue now.

Good Luck,

KB

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"I'm not trying to get it perfect. I'm trying to get it finished!"
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