Key Largo Build in Charleston

A forum for contacting other builders of Ken Hankinson designs. These designs are now a part of the Glen-L family.

Moderators: Bill Edmundson, billy c

mickfly
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by mickfly » Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:15 am

Thanks Bryan. My travel over the next few weeks will prevent me from covering in March, but I should be able to get it done by end of April. I still have to sand the starboard side before planking...you know, the starboard side that's on the left!

Have you given any thought to stain choice? I want the grain to show some...and have seen a red filler stain used. Pretty, but I wonder about something more translucent?...and maybe a little more toward brown shades. I suppose I could mix a red and brown stain until it gets me where I want and then carefully record the "formula?"

boisebrit
Posts: 57
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:42 pm
Location: Boise, Idaho

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by boisebrit » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:39 pm

On the stain front I am following the example of a local builder working on a barrel back really liked the results.

I have done a test stain, then a coat of smith cpes, then varnish, have not got down the clean room conditions yet and right brushes etc but here is a pic of the test piece and the stain I am using.

Find if you apply then wipe down you get the transparency and the grain really comes through. The test piece also has famowood filler on some test holes. Found if I just stained and varnished then the famowood stood out a bit more, if I stained then CPES and then varnish it blended in far better. Probably letting the stain bleed more into the famowood.

Still learning and will do some serious test pieces before the real deal.

Bryan
Attachments
IMG_9934.JPG
IMG_9933.JPG

Hercdrvr
Posts: 689
Joined: Mon May 11, 2015 12:52 pm
Location: McKinney TX

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by Hercdrvr » Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:22 am

That looks very nice. Sometimes the Chris Craft Mahogany stain looks more like brown paint to me but your technique shows the wood well.
I’m keeping an eye on what you’re up to as I am only a few months behind your build. Please continue to post progress reports.
Matt B

PeterG
Posts: 569
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:08 am
Location: Connecticut

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by PeterG » Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:07 am

I agree with Matt B about your sample, it looks great. This is the authentic stain used by Chris Craft. This is the method I will be using for my deck instead of epoxy encapsulation. I think Roberta's Zip was refinished (topsides and deck) using a similar method, the results were stunning. I have seen projects where the stain looked like a paint because of how it was applied thick, maybe wasn't wiped off properly? Don Danenberg's book on mahogany boat restoration describes the exact same process you used with the CPES sealing the stain and then varnishing. Though a heads up, from reading his forum recently he now uses Pettit sealer in place of the CPES because he sometimes had problems with the CPES causing the stain to liquefy and smear. I say use what has worked for you!
Murphy's Law: Anything that can go wrong, will go wrong.
Griffin's Law: Murphy was an optimist.

boisebrit
Posts: 57
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:42 pm
Location: Boise, Idaho

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by boisebrit » Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:38 am

Thanks will keep posting, I am going to try some of the petit now thanks for the heads up as another test and also some of there varnish vs Epifanes, which I used on the sample. Will post the results when done, I have committed to the stain but the outer clear layers I want the best result with the easiest (Bryan proof) application

Bryan

mickfly
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by mickfly » Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:49 pm

Bryan:
That color looks perfect! I will be ordering the Sandusky stain. I also placed my order for famowood today. I read where some builders seal with diluted clear acrylic BEFORE stain ... to prevent from "muddying" the grain but your sample looks great. How long did you wait before wiping?

boisebrit
Posts: 57
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:42 pm
Location: Boise, Idaho

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by boisebrit » Fri Mar 23, 2018 4:04 pm

I pretty much stained it fairly wet with one or two passes and then wiped off in a few seconds/minutes, if it is not dark enough it is a stain you can add and wipe again, as it is not sealing the wood.

My very first test I left the stain on and sure enough it was like a dark red paint all the grain filled. I think the challenge will be staining and wiping across the whole of the hull and keeping wet and making sure it is not patching or there are lines. Will make sure I have two of us one to stain and one to wipe.


Bryan

mickfly
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by mickfly » Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:23 am

Thanks. I'll be doing some test peices and will post. I ordered the Petit sealer and will try before and after... I also ordered the walnut stain for the covering boards. Still a lot of detail work before stain goes on...and of course the hull gets epoxy and glass before varnish...so maybe I'll test that too?

mickfly
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by mickfly » Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:43 am

I'm using the "router" method for scribing the sapele planking to get it to fit tight against the previous board. In other posts I saw a cleverly designed fence to run against the adjacent board, but when I went to purchase a compact router, both the Bosch and Makita had a built in fence. I bought the Makita. I already had a 1/8 straight bit...and am able to set the bit edge flush with the fence. Very little waste from the router cut...

Anyway...thought I would post a picture of the router set up and describe my process. Starting at the chine, I fit the top row of strakes against the "spiled" line, then stapled that row lightly in place, leaving the bottom loose. The next row of sapele was shoved under the previous and I ran the router fence against the top board edge. The router bit is set at a depth to nearly cut through the sapele, but not cut into the plywood planking. A little work with a sanding block and plane...and the fit is great. A little more knife, plane and sander work to get the bottom edge to hit its spile line...This was painful at first, but now I use a ruler to estimate how much waste to cut and then can plane and sand to get right on the line...

I dry fit the entire side, then removed and numbered before gluing (gel magic) and stapling through a piece of rope. The next day, I pulled out the rope and the staples left behind, usually only one leg of the staple remains in the wood. It only took about six hours to glue in place. Tonight, I start the starboard side.

Note: The fit is a bit less than perfect where the boards end on the bow (the last two feet), but I've saved enough time using this method that I don't mind spending a bit of time with some thin filler pieces.
Attachments
makita router with fence 2.jpg
makita router with fence 1.jpg

mickfly
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by mickfly » Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:20 pm

Quick question for the forum. In the picture below, I countersunk, screwed, and filled (famowood) the first few screws through the final planking, into the chine. The one of the left in the photo below, is through the side planking and into the bottom planking. After doing one I thought...maybe better to get the screw threads into the long grain of the chine? So...I put the next few down a bit lower. However, the 1 1/4 screws the plans call for pop through just a bit on the inside. I can easily file them down, but thought I would ask...better to...

Screw into the bottom planking?
Screw into the chine?
Alternate?
Attachments
famowood filled plugs.jpg

User avatar
DrBryanJ
Posts: 774
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:05 am
Location: New Jersey

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by DrBryanJ » Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:50 pm

If the plywood is screwed into place, does the veneer need to be screwed in as well. I didn't screw mine in.
Bryan

Building a malahini "Mona Lisa"

My wife said "If I build a boat, she's getting a divorce."

PeterG
Posts: 569
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:08 am
Location: Connecticut

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by PeterG » Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:16 pm

Always better to screw into the chines instead of the bottom planking. The screws will get a more secure, better bite into the long grain of the chines. Screwing into the bottom planking is going into the plywood edge grain, which risks prying apart the laminations in the plywood or between the layers of plywood, the screws can loosen over time. From my Key Largo plans the sides are 3/8" thick and 3/4" thick chines gives 1-1/8" material to screw into, the 1-1/4" screws are too long. I suggest using 1" or better yet use 7/8" screws into the chine. Or even trimming off the ones you have to the shorter length, just use a steel screw to "thread" the hole first? Good news none of this is hard to fix, no undoing anything which is always a plus!
Last edited by PeterG on Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Murphy's Law: Anything that can go wrong, will go wrong.
Griffin's Law: Murphy was an optimist.

PeterG
Posts: 569
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:08 am
Location: Connecticut

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by PeterG » Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:31 pm

Hi Bryan! The Key Largo and it's siblings the Belle Isle and Barrelback are cold molded in three 1/8" layers in the sides instead of a single layer of 1/4" plywood like our Malahinis. Your veneer is just fine without screws through it if you've already screwed on the plywood first. Think of your veneer as somewhat a cosmetic layer where you've already met the design planking thickness before the veneer was installed. The side planking of the Key Largo needs three layers per the design and the outer layer is more structural, less cosmetic and should have the screws installed after the outer layer is on.
Murphy's Law: Anything that can go wrong, will go wrong.
Griffin's Law: Murphy was an optimist.

User avatar
DrBryanJ
Posts: 774
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:05 am
Location: New Jersey

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by DrBryanJ » Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:34 pm

I understand now. Thought the outer layer was cosmetic like the malahihi
Bryan

Building a malahini "Mona Lisa"

My wife said "If I build a boat, she's getting a divorce."

mickfly
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:19 am

Re: Key Largo Build in Charleston

Post by mickfly » Mon Apr 02, 2018 7:04 pm

Thanks all. I found some one inch silicone bronze screws. I tried a few on the chine. Worked great.

Post Reply

Return to “Hankinson designs”