I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Designs for inboard or outboard power

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raymacke
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by raymacke »

What I will say is I don't see how the ACR could be back feeding power. It operates on the battery side of things and if the engine is truly ON all the time the voltage is entering the harness at some point. The only place I would think it even possible is if the optional wire is run from the "SI" lug (Starting Isolation) to the wrong place. But I would think even if connected to constant power it would just prevent the banks from being charged - not back feed. Not 100% about this but seems right when you study how the unit functions.

CURT - I can't find anything in my directions or the current instructions online about the ACR running down batteries if left on. Actually, I can't figure how you could switch it off unless you add two switches (or a double pole single throw) breaking each wire running from the battery to lugs A and B. The diagrams show fuses in these but there are no switches. Do you have a link to this? I have never had a problem with discharging when sitting but then again mine is always on the charger when not in use and normally charged by the engine everyday when in use.

CHUGALUG - The older style battery "combiners" were normally diode based and a 1/2 volt drop was normal but problematic as the batteries were prevented from being fully charges. The Blue Seas ACR does not use simple diodes to achieve separation and the voltage drop is avoided - at least that is what they claim. This was the main reason most systems now use it or a similar unit from another company.
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chugalug
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by chugalug »

Don't know what Bill has for battery switch-Blue seas also has feature that both house and cranking batteries are combined for emergency engine start,then switch to on after engine start.I'm sure Perko has the same as well.Maybe switch is faulty if still hooked up correctly.I'm just fishing as I need to hook mine up in future.
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"If it's not crooked,It's not mine

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curtgard
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by curtgard »

I will be the first to admit that boat wiring is somewhat confusing for me. That's why I used all Blue Seas electrical components. Their wiring diagrams showed how to wire thing pretty good. I used Blue Seas 7601 ACR and the wiring diagram shows putting in a switch to prevent battery drainage. If you don't, I don't know how long it will take to drain the battery. You can pull up the wiring diagram on the Blue Seas web site. The switch is actually on the ground side along with a 10 amp fuse.

Curt

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kens
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by kens »

I believe, (I cannot prove) that Bill has 2 things going on.
1. a bad battery that is draining itself.
2. a electronic engine that is wired around (bypassing) his battery select (cutoff) switch
Oak is over rated, everything about it takes extra time; then it warps, splits or checks !!! :roll:

Ozzieboat
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by Ozzieboat »

kens
I said I didn't know Bill's particular engine, but most engine ECU's are wired hot to retain their "ADAPTIVE MEMORY", not their "mapping memory" as you have incorrectly assumed.

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raymacke
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by raymacke »

I agree with KENS - IF the "Master Switch" Bill referred to is the "battery selector" and not the O/B's key switch. I was thinking of key switch that turns the engine off and on but that maybe wrong. Still don't think the problem is with the ACR though.

WARNING - if not interested in ACRs (Automatic Charging Relay) what's below will probably bore you!

CURT - I stand corrected! It looks like I have a different Blue Seas ACR. Mine is the 7610 which is a 120 amp version where yours is a 65 amp unit. Still nowhere in the current literature do they suggest a kill switch for mine. But on your newer 7601 it does indeed suggest a switch might help. The units are very similar so this made no sense to me that yours could benefit from the switch but not mine. I decided to check mine and indeed there is a small drain of .013 amps. Rather than guess why the difference I called Blue Seas. They stated that both units do create a amperage draw if left connected. They also said your 7601 would use about 1/2 what mine does and they quoted .0075 amps. These are very small amounts BUT they said over time - a month or more like in winter storage - it could deplete a battery. Because of that they suggest with BOTH units a switch breaking the "ground" wire to disable it might be a good idea.

I then mentioned when not in use I have a 3 stage charger attached to the system to maintain the batteries. They commented if left on a charger the suggestion was to NOT used a switch to cut it off as the active ACR will actually benefit the charging system. So it seems the concern is with long term non use on non maintained batteries.

So It seems if you don't leave you batteries on a battery maintainer the switch may help but if you do it is not needed. I didn't realize this but now we know. It would be nice if their directions clarified this and were updated for my unit to mention the possible benefit. Oh well......
So Many Rivers,
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Bill Edmundson
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by Bill Edmundson »

I'm so confused. :? :? Anyway, I did make some progress. New battery in, tarp over the cockpit, electronics adjustments, fresh water in the tank and pump working, and rinsed the outside off. Back-up. I did scratch the hull (about 3") putting the boat back in the storage lot. It was the last slot and not really big enough. There was an old fence post sticking up. I saw it and hit it anyway.

Bill
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chugalug
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by chugalug »

Too bad about the scratch,Bill.Now you won't feel too bad when you drag that big ol' slimy fish over the side. :D
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Bill Edmundson
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by Bill Edmundson »

Chug

Back when I did whitewater boating we always said that a new boat should come with the first scratch!

Bill
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Bill Edmundson
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by Bill Edmundson »

NEWS! The Bartender is back in military service after 50 years. The USCG has ordered three for use on the CGC Eagle. They are aluminum, LOA 26', beam 7'-10", inboard, with center console. It is designated as MSB (Motor Surf Boat).

Just found it interesting that 1950's designs just keep showing up.

https://www.facebook.com/bartenderboats ... S_TIMELINE

Bill
Mini -Tug, KH Tahoe 19 & Bartender 24 - There can be no miracle recoveries without first screwing up.
Tahoe 19 Build

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Bill Edmundson
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by Bill Edmundson »

Frustration! I came down to Gulf Shores to try to get some work done on the BT. First, I had to replace the garbage disposal in the condo.

I need to raise the engine box, which I'll do back in B'ham. But, I had to get about 50 gals. of water off the tarp. 50 gals of water had pulled one of the cowling doors off its hinges.

While waiting for help to get help with the engine box, I started playing with the trim to get the cavitation plate parallel to the bottom of the boat. Before I got there I noticed the engine foot hit the fold down well plug. This is not going to be easy. The front face of the plug is both sloped and curved.

I went inside the cabin to work on the galley shelves. The one that will support the drawer is 1/2" too high and the drawer won't go in.

Now, it's raining!

Bill :( :roll:
Mini -Tug, KH Tahoe 19 & Bartender 24 - There can be no miracle recoveries without first screwing up.
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bob smith
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by bob smith »

Happy New Year!
Bob Smith
Chester, SC

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Bill Edmundson
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by Bill Edmundson »

Stretching wood. I brought the engine box home to make it taller. This has been a fairly easy fix. I've built a part of the v-berth/table and ready to paint. I'm going to do this, yet!

Bill
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jenko
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by jenko »

looks like a bit of thinking there Bill

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Bill Edmundson
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Re: I guess it's time to come out of the closet!Bartender 24

Post by Bill Edmundson »

Yes Pete. It definitely was NOT in the plans. Yamaha change the engine up on me! Part 2 will be more difficult. The fold down plug in the engine well is too long. I have a plan.

There can be no miracle recoveries without first screwing up!

Bill
Mini -Tug, KH Tahoe 19 & Bartender 24 - There can be no miracle recoveries without first screwing up.
Tahoe 19 Build

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