16' Ski Boat Restoration

Designs for inboard or outboard power

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Bill Edmundson
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Bill Edmundson » Sat Dec 16, 2017 7:19 am

Jim

That is the tank fill. The tank vent is on the side of the boat. I have a diesel in this boat. technically I'm not required to have extra ventilation. Many of the regs. don't apply to the home builder. Inspection in Alabama is by the state. It's mostly, they come to your house and say "Yep, that's a new home build. Here's your HIN."

On the Tahoe the fuel water separator is on the engine. On the Bartender, I put a separate filter/separator per Yamaha's requirements.

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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby 283 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 7:51 am

Milhouse wrote:Should the ignition switch be on the opposite side as the throttle so that I can "pump the gas" with my right hand and turn the key with my left?
I noticed that they key was on the left side originally but I just thought the guy may have been left handed; thinking about it more there may have been another reason?

It has a carbureted 327 and if its anything like my 302 in my 67 Falcon it will take a bit of "pumping the gas" to get it started...

It will have an electric fuel pump with the required N/O oil pressure switch to shut it off when the motor is off and cranking bypass to allow fuel to get pumped when cranking and I was thinking of adding a momentary switch to prime the line and fill the carb bowls to make starting it more reliable and reduce engine wear. I suppose that would go on the right hand side as that will be depressed prior to cranking.

Still also wondering about 1 fuel gauge with a a switch or two gauges any opinions on that?


I can’t think of any reason not to have the key on the left. Definitely easier to deal with the choke and throttle settings when you can use two hands.

Just don’t put the key where you’re likely to bump it with your knee when you go to stand up.
Mike

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JoeM
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby JoeM » Sat Dec 16, 2017 8:38 am

Milhouse wrote:My word...Every time I pick up a new USCG spec I get scared!

I didn't get a fancy label per 183.510 so I need to ask my fabricator about that...

183.564 Fuel tank fill system.
(a) Each fuel fill opening must be located so that a gasoline overflow of up to five gallons per minute for at least five seconds will not enter the boat when the boat is in its static floating position.
So it looks like I need to investigate how to do that (see pic of where the fills were located before), perhaps I can add a splash guard?

Bill - Did you test 183.564 on your Tahoe? I see what looks like the fuel fill really close to a vent.

Joe - I don't see a spec about self leveling tanks (can you point me to that section). I do see a spec that the electric fuel pump needs to be < 12" from the engine so that helps narrow down where I put it.

How did you all design your "flame arrestors" on your fuel vent per 183.505

183.505
A flame arrestor for a fuel tank may be a specially designed fitting with flame arresting elements,
such as screens, or the vent tubing may itself be effective.

Does anyone have an opinion on water separators / filter?

What did you use to add a bead to the fuel line per 183.530

183.530 Spud, pipe, and hose fitting configuration.
Except when used for a tank fill line, each spud, pipe, or hose fitting used with hose clamps must have:
(a) A bead;
(b) A flare; or
(c) A series of annular grooves or serrations no less than 0.015 inches deep, except a continuous helical thread, knurl, or groove.


The regulation I was pointing out doesn't explicitly say that the balancing of the fuel levels is a no-no so it was probably overlooked. However, you have to keep all fitting above the top-most surface of the tank. To balance the fuel level the fitting's would be placed on the bottom tying the two together with gravity doing the work. The reason why it's ok to do that with diesels is because they are exempt from most of the regulations, as Bill pointed out, since diesel isn't as explosive, though it is flammable.

183.518 Fuel tank openings.
Each opening into the fuel tank must be at or above the topmost surface of
the tank.


I've found that many of the fuel line vents that I have looked at for my build have a flame arrestor screen already installed.

As far as water filter/separator goes, I think they are definitely necessary, though I don't have a preference on which brand or anything.

I'm pretty sure the bead/flare on fittings will usually already be there. It shouldn't have to be added by you.
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Milhouse
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Milhouse » Sat Dec 16, 2017 9:31 am

Thanks Joe, I see what you are referring to. That gravity approach was not my plan. All of the holes in the tank are indeed on top.

I was thinking of plumbing both tanks to the fuel pump with a Y-fitting so it draws from them at the same time insread of having a tank switch. Do you see any issues with that approach?

Any opinions on the fuel fill spill spec?
Jim
16' Ski Boat Restoration
17' Overnighter Sloop

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Milhouse
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Milhouse » Sat Dec 16, 2017 9:41 am

Thanks Mike for the key location advice.

Thanks Bill for the explanation about the Tahoe and home built regulations, seems like CA you just go to the DMV and show them receipts (in my case since this is a restoration it is already registered). But I am worried about being boarded by the USCG, if I run in the ocean, and failing the inspection. Has that happened to anyone here?

Does anyone here have a momentary fuel priming switch on a gas engine? The spec mention the starting process as an exemption so I'm thinking that it falls in there.
Jim
16' Ski Boat Restoration
17' Overnighter Sloop

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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby JoeM » Sat Dec 16, 2017 10:25 am

Milhouse wrote:Thanks Joe, I see what you are referring to. That gravity approach was not my plan. All of the holes in the tank are indeed on top.

I was thinking of plumbing both tanks to the fuel pump with a Y-fitting so it draws from them at the same time insread of having a tank switch. Do you see any issues with that approach?

Any opinions on the fuel fill spill spec?


In theory, no. Keep in mind i'm pretty new at this as well. Rather than use a Y-fitting I would personally use a 4-way selector valve. That way you can turn it to off, port tank, starboard tank, or both tanks.

The fuel fill spec is something i'm also wrapping my head around. It seems to me like the main thing is to select the right type of hose and route it correctly. A-1 is the highest specced whereas B-2 is the lower spec that we can use depending on the system. Again though, i'm still wrapping my head around this topic so I could be way off base. But I personally have plenty of time to worry about that as I haven't even started cutting wood.

edit: in response to your reply to Bill and the USCG boarding you. I would have the USCG Auxiliary perform a free Vessel Safety Check once you're ready to go. They'll pretty much give the same exact inspection that the USCG will perform free of charge and without any type of fine or anything for issues they find. If you pass, you get a sticker that proves you passed and a form that you keep with you. If you get boarded by USCG they may see the sticker and ask to see the form and let you go rather than actually inspect you. They also still have the right to inspect. But this gives them assurance that you're in the clear and if they have no other reason to conduct an inspection they let you go, saving you and them time.
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psychobilly
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby psychobilly » Sat Dec 16, 2017 10:57 am

Yup, got mine 4 free.

B1118D0A-FD9B-4DA8-A6AF-FF8FC06E2038.jpeg

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Milhouse
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Milhouse » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:34 pm

psychobilly - did they look for design relates issues like the fuel fill spill spec or just things like PFDs horns and lights etc?

I'll be sure to take it to them for an inspection for piece of mind.

Joe I love the idea of a 4 way valve. I'll look for one and post what I find.

Regarding the momentary priming switch for the electric fuel pump: What might be more in line letter of the law is a momentary cranking bypass switch. That way if i want to prime the line I perform the typical sequence but also press the crank inhibit switch so I can fill the carb bowls without wasted cranking cycles. Then I would just release the switch to start cranking.

hopefully I'll start on my schematic this weekend and I'll show you all what I decide.
Jim
16' Ski Boat Restoration
17' Overnighter Sloop

I'd rather have a $h!tty meal than an $h!tty resume because a totally awesome resume will feed me steak one day - Steve Poltz

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psychobilly
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby psychobilly » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:57 pm

Yes, the gentleman that came out was very knowledgeable and I even learned a few things I didn’t know.

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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby JoeM » Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:12 am

This is the valve I was planning on using in my TrueGrit build(still in planning stages) until I switched to my current 3 tank plan.

https://www.westmarine.com/buy/groco--fv-450-x-tank-selector-valve--15972748?recordNum=15
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Milhouse
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Milhouse » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:05 pm

Thanks Joe. Ill pick one up shortly.
Jim
16' Ski Boat Restoration
17' Overnighter Sloop

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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Milhouse » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:31 pm

Well it looks like I got some coal in my stocking this year; Rotten Stringer in the boat!

I was cleaning the mini-bilge getting ready to paint it with primer and bilgecoat and I noticed a small area of delaminated fiberglass mat. I drilled a 3/4" hole with a forster bit and I opened up pandoras box. About three quarters of the Starboard Stringer was totally rotten.

I have cleaned it out and cut out enough of the floor out to locate solid wood in the bow section. I have cut it back on an angle. I will splice in a piece of sapeli and add some dowels for extra holding power.

I drilled some test holes in the port stringer to see if it was a goner as well but it looks pristine! So that is good news.

Since I had the bow section cut open I stuck my hand in there and found about 1/2 Gallon of some nasty brown water!

I will be adding in some inspection hatches into the for bilge which I didn't even realize was a sealed bilge till now!

Glad that I looked, Looking online it looks like rotten stringers is a very common issue on older Fiberglass boats.
Attachments
stringer.jpg
stringer_gone.jpg
scarf.jpg
Jim
16' Ski Boat Restoration
17' Overnighter Sloop

I'd rather have a $h!tty meal than an $h!tty resume because a totally awesome resume will feed me steak one day - Steve Poltz

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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby PeterG » Sun Dec 17, 2017 10:38 pm

Rotted wood stringers are a very common problem with older ski boats, I was curious to know whether you had checked those when you started this project... Good luck with that, and beware of saturated flotation foam. I follow the Correct Craft Fan Club forum and it is full of projects where these repairs had to be done. You might check those out for pointers with your boat's stringers and foam. Also, you might consider using Smith's CPES (clear penetrating epoxy sealer) to treat the wood before fiberglasing, repairs remnants of rot and protects the good wood.
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Milhouse
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Milhouse » Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:49 pm

PeterG - Thanks for the Correct Craft Fan Club forum. They have some good posts on stringer replacement.

I picked up some CPES which I will be applying to the section of the remaining stringer which looks in good condition and the new stringer.

I picked up a 10' piece of 8/4 Sapeli for $80. It was conveniently S3S to my desired thickness of 1.75"

The pic shows the scribing on the sapeli as I was gong to skip the template but I decided that I didn't want to gamble with the nice piece of wood so I made a template out of 1/4" MDF. The scribing got me pretty close and then I touched up the template with a blockplane.

The plan is to cut and fit the stringer tomorrow.
Attachments
20171220_163545.jpg
Fitting the front of the MDF stringer template
scribe.jpg
Using my impromptu scribe
Jim
16' Ski Boat Restoration
17' Overnighter Sloop

I'd rather have a $h!tty meal than an $h!tty resume because a totally awesome resume will feed me steak one day - Steve Poltz

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Milhouse
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Re: 16' Ski Boat Restoration

Postby Milhouse » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:22 am

Stringer Cut and fit!

It was the ugliest cutting job with a jigsaw I have ever done but no one will ever see it after it gets glassed up.

I pulled it back out and just put on a coat of CPES. It is my first time using it, its more watery and smelly than I thought it would be. I got used to west system it seems.
Attachments
20171221_125359.jpg
20171221_141139.jpg
20171221_135205.jpg
Jim
16' Ski Boat Restoration
17' Overnighter Sloop

I'd rather have a $h!tty meal than an $h!tty resume because a totally awesome resume will feed me steak one day - Steve Poltz


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