Riviera Build - Sacramento

Designs for inboard or outboard power

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KenEnglund
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Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:47 pm
Location: Sacramento, CA

Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by KenEnglund »

I'm just staring my build and pouring through the boards and books. I had a few quick questions as I get moving on the frames..


1) Would there be a good reason to put floor timbers on both sides of the frame or only on one side per the plan?

2) Is there any benefit to making the bottom frame members out of one piece of wood versus two which are joined by the floor timbers?

3) Just wanted to confirm as the frames are set on the motor stringers, that it looks like the floor timber face toward the transom vs the bow?

4) As I position the frames on the motor stringer, are the plan measurement to the center of the frame, edge of frame, or does it matters?


Thanks for the help!

denbrlr
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Location: Peoria, IL

Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by denbrlr »

Good luck with your build. In response to your questions:
1) I think putting them on both sides would be overkill. Glen-L knew what he was doing when he designed these boats :)
2) I made most out of one piece on my Monaco but I don't think you need to.
3) If you look closely at the drawings, some face towards the bow and some face towards the stern (assuming the Riveria plans are similar to the Monaco).
4) I don't think it is that critical but it will affect the overall length of your boat. This is an area where you have some flexibility because you can shorten or lengthen by 10%. On my Monaco, I measured edge to edge and added 0.5 inch extra (i.e. spaced them 26.5 inches apart where the plans called for 26).

Have fun.

Lee
YouTube channel: Boat Builder Lee
Monaco build YouTube playlist: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP4Edb ... /playlists

KenEnglund
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Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:47 pm
Location: Sacramento, CA

Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by KenEnglund »

Lee,

Thanks for the answers and having poured though about 5 pages of your build, I've already gotten several answers I was looking for. I'll keep reviewing, but had a follow up question and request:

1) Did you nail or screw your gussets? I think it looks like you screwed them (#8's)?

2) Did you given any consideration into slightly notching the motor stringers for the frames to lock them in (in addition to the clips and expoxy)?

2) Following your stringer build, posts, I've decided to scarf and lam. I was curious what you actual dimensions ended up being (W & H)?

3) You've pics have been really helpful. Wondering if you might have a detailed pic of the attachment of the stem to Frame 7 and the transom to the motor stringers.


Thanks again...

Hercdrvr
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by Hercdrvr »

Here’s a picture of Barrelback right after the flip, my motor stringers are notched into the frames about 1/4”.
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Roberta
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by Roberta »

If you notch the frames into the stringers, be sure to allow for the notch and not change any set points. Also consider the orientation of the clips. Sometimes putting them fore or aft of the frame or inside or outside of the stringers helps keep them away from the engine or other components.

Roberta
Roberta "Queen of the Boat Builders"
Built Zip "Oliver IV", Super Spartan "Jimmy 70", and Torpedo "The Glen L".

denbrlr
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by denbrlr »

Glad to help. To answer your questions:
1) I nailed my gussets with ring shank nails per the plans. I drilled pilot holes through the gussets first. I did use #8 screws for the floor timbers per the plans.

2) I didn't notch the frames in the stringers. The clips hold them very well but pay attention to making them square and true. It might seem like you need to notch them for more rigidity (if that is what you were thinking) but they are very solid with the clips and epoxy. Also, things get really solid once you attach the sheer clamps, chines, and battens.

3) I don't exactly remember the final width of my stringers but I believe they are about 1.6 inches (i.e. a little over the 1.5 inches for a standard 2x6). I believe the height is the standard 5.5 inches (i.e. same as a standard 2x6).

4) Glad the pictures are helpful. Here are a few pictures that show some more detail. This is the best I could find. I didn't permanently attach the transom until the keel notches were cut so I could get the transom height correct. I used a long level to make sure my keel notches were in line on a horizontal plane.

Lee
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Monaco build YouTube playlist: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP4Edb ... /playlists

TomB
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by TomB »

Ken,

The plans for the Tahoe call for notched stringers, so I notched them. I clamped the stringers together and did the layout work for frame spacing and cut the notches as pairs.

If your small scale plans call for notching, notch, if not, not.

Tom
In the home stretch on a Tahoe 23

denbrlr
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by denbrlr »

I agree with Tom. The Monaco plans do not call for notched stringers but I am not sure about the Riviera plans.

Lee
YouTube channel: Boat Builder Lee
Monaco build YouTube playlist: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP4Edb ... /playlists

Yakima
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by Yakima »

Riviera doesnt have notched stringers...Id be a bit concerned about the integrity of the stringers with all those notches....but I am a worry kinda guy.

Doubling up the plywood at the floor is overkill - these things are heavy enough without adding half a sheet of plywood to it. Id stick with the plans. I would suggest taking your time in cutting our the pieces, and wiping up epoxy. repeat that last one a few times...I wish I had paid more attention to wiping up epoxy. It was a mess that took days to (partially) clean up after the flip. And once you get to the flip, find the article about using pulleys and marine line, to rotate it in place and not building a huge wheel, or hiring 10 guys...I did it one handed.

Greg

denbrlr
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by denbrlr »

I need to clarify/correct a comment in a previous post where I said "I used a long level to make sure my keel notches were in line on a horizontal plane." What I should have said is that I used a long level to make sure my keel notches were in line on the same plane. During the build on a Monaco before the flip, the keel is not horizontal (but the motor stringers are horizontal).

Lee
YouTube channel: Boat Builder Lee
Monaco build YouTube playlist: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP4Edb ... /playlists

KenEnglund
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Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:47 pm
Location: Sacramento, CA

Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by KenEnglund »

Hi,

I finally completed my frames and transom finished, so on to new parts. I did have a few questions for the group:

1) Should I plan on just coat of epoxy for encapsulation if there aren't any application issues (air bubbles, etc.)?

2) When I notch the frames for the side and bottom battens, should I make the notches shallow so the battens are proud of the frame, or just make them flush?

3) I'm planning on scarfing and laminating sapele for my motor stringers. I'm wonder if I need to put any screws in the lams, or just epoxy and clamp them is strong enough?

4) For frames 1 & 6, they indicate not to glue the deck beams onto the sides as they will need to be "relocated". I'm trying to understand what that actually means as I didn't quite understand clearly the "relocation" comment even after looking as the deck instructions


Thanks again... I'll try to get a few pics attached, but my system crashes every time I'm attach them, so wanted to get my questions out there first.

KenEnglund
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Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:47 pm
Location: Sacramento, CA

Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by KenEnglund »

Got the pics uploaded!
ACF4BCAB-D66B-497B-92A3-54D0C41F3B88.jpeg
A6398A27-4669-49A1-8CB3-1CEAA9EB1C4A.jpeg

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Jimbob
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by Jimbob »

Nice work! Looking good.
Jim
Jim Neeley
Building a Barrelback in Sacramento, CA
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Roberta
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by Roberta »

Nice work!

1. Coating should adequately cover without dry spots. Depending on wood porosity, subsequent coats might be necessary.

2. I notched so things were flush.

3. I would at least use some locating screws at joints and ends. Ring shank nails could be used for additional mechanical attachment.

4. It might mean you need to leave them free in order to install on the build form. Then bolt and glue to side members.

Hope this helps,

Roberta
Roberta "Queen of the Boat Builders"
Built Zip "Oliver IV", Super Spartan "Jimmy 70", and Torpedo "The Glen L".

denbrlr
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Re: Riviera Build - Sacramento

Post by denbrlr »

Looking good. Here are my thoughts:

1) I'm not sure exactly what your question is but I would apply more than one coat of epoxy for encapsulation. There are differing opinions on the use of CPES as part of the encapsulation process (i.e. apply CPES before epoxy) but that is something to consider. I didn't use CPES on my frames but if I did it over, I would have used it (probably two coats) prior to my coats of encapsulating epoxy. I started using CPES later in the build as part of encapsulating.

2) I also notched so they were flush. I think most do that and I think that is the intent of the plans.

3) I didn't use any fasteners when I clamped my stringer lams. The epoxy is what will provide plenty of holding strength but adding fasteners certainly wouldn't hurt anything. Like Roberta said, it could help you locate them during clamp up. Take your time and make a good jig for epoxying the stringer lams. I found that I needed to do some fairing of the edges after they were epoxied to get good clean edges so no matter how much you try to line them up, you probably will need to clean up the edges.

4) Monaco plans have the same instructions. I believe this is due to the fact that frame #6 (I think this is a typo and should be frame #5) would be in the middle of the front cockpit so it will need to be moved. The same is true for frame #1 which would be in the middle of the rear cockpit.

Lee
YouTube channel: Boat Builder Lee
Monaco build YouTube playlist: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP4Edb ... /playlists

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