Glen-L.com

Hi All,
I'm looking at buying 1/4" (6mm) plywood for my Zip project. I'm assuming that a 5 ply product would be superior to a 3 ply product in this application. How critical is the number of plies. I can get Occume and DF locally in 3 ply ($80 and $55) or Meranti 5 ply ordered in for $85. Any advice?? All are supposedly BS1088 although, as I understand it, 1/4" must have 5 plies to comply with this standard? Any advice??
Blair

Blair,

My understanding is that more Plys the better.. from what I've read on the Glen-L site. I'd be surprised if your getting BS1088 Marine grade ply in anything less than a 5ply sheet for 1/4" in Occume or Meranti.

I wouldn't sweat the few $$ difference for your ZIP.. I'd get the 5 ply for sure in either of the materials.

Your pricing seems pretty good compared to what I can get locally in Edmonton:
http://www.boatcraft.com/AllProds.php?dept=83

I ordered my Meranti from BC.. www.westwindhardwood.com .. and its worked out great. I also ordered my Sapelle lumber at the same time. They send me good quality stuff (from what I can tell as a rookie).. I'd recommend them to anyone.

I have full background info on my lumber purchase here if you want to read it:

Lumber Pricing - Western Canada - Malahini Quick Comparison

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Ian (aka Iggy)
My Malahini Build

I'm not so sure I would get dougfir ply for a boat as I've heard there are some issues with it checking unless you use fiberglass on it.

Thanks guys,
It looks like the new entry in the plywood game is Noah's in Ont. They came back with a price of about $72 per sheet for 6mm Meranti 5 ply including delivery. I think I can live with that. The thought of bending DF ply was terrifying me as I have used a lot of it in odd shaped concrete forms and it took a lot of Bondo to make them look good. Non stop checking until we got the form coating on and even then... I'm not normally such a skinflint on things like this, but we lease our cottage lot from an Indian Band and they have set this year's rate at about 700% higher than last year (from $746 per year to $5,265 per year for the next 5 years). This is due at the end of the month. It will likely end up in Federal Court and hopefully be reduced, but I still have to pay it for at least the short term. This little issue is giving my boat budget a beating.
Blair

Most of my ply for the Tahoe came from Noah. All mine was really good quality.

The shipping killed me!

Bill

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Mini -Tug, KH Tahoe 19 & Bartender 24 - There can be no miracle recoveries without first screwing up.
Tahoe 19 Build

is there anything wrong with using douglas fir? thats what my plans call for.

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Built the 17' Glen-L "Sea Knight"

There is nothing wrong with using DF. But, they/we want you to be aware that you really should glass over it. That holds the surface together. It will "check". That will crack a paint or epoxy only finish. Then water gets to the wood...

Every boat has a different purpose to the builder. Maybe, it's a practice build. Maybe, you only want it for few years. Maybe, you want your Grand Chillin' to inherit it.

Bill

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Mini -Tug, KH Tahoe 19 & Bartender 24 - There can be no miracle recoveries without first screwing up.
Tahoe 19 Build

i am definitly glassing over it so DF will probably work fine for me. GOOD STUFF..THANKS!!

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Built the 17' Glen-L "Sea Knight"

darthplywood,

The only thing I will say do the math first. Is it really worth the savings? You will put your heart and soul into this build and you are wanting to save money on the very thing that will keep it afloat. Not only checking but those darn footballs will come out.



Bill, I knew I should have gotten that copyrighted.

Chip

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A secret to a good marriage is to have a quick mind and a slow mouth!!!

IMNHO avoiding DF is worth the effort. It's not "if" it will check, but when they will show up. When the panel was made the loose side is full of checking, and toward the center of the panel. The checks are already in the panel the day the veneer comes off the lathe in every species of rotary cut material, you just don't get to adore them until later! Softwoods are more likely to check as a result of the hardness variances between the wood, and the growth rings. Panels made from smaller logs, or from the centers of larger logs are the very worst for cracks.


Besides, laminating with glass cloth on both sides is going to be a PITA, in the end, costing more in $$$, time, effort, and worst... weight, than using a decent panel will. Just encapsulating it isn't enough, it needs cloth to reinforce against checking.

DF made these days is so miserable, and the surfaces are sooooooooo poor, it's not even worth considering using the stuff for anything you want to look decent, or is exposed to water. Good materials are fun to work with, garbage is not, no matter how cheap it was. (from a chronic cheapskate that has learned that lesson over, and over, and over............ and over.)

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Some plan to stroll through Saint Peter's Gates, I plan to go through them at 150mph... backwards... in a screaming ball of flame, with a glimmer belt wrapped around my head, and a NOx button in my hand.

Another thing you will find with DF ply is that the dark coloured grain lines will be much harder wood than the rest of the face. You have to be very carefull when sanding or the dark grain line will end up high and the softer light coloured areas will be low. Also the edges of the panel will tend to splinter. DF ply is very tough, strong stuff, but working with it does have its little challenges. I have probably bent about 500 sheets of 1/4" DF G1S into assorted shapes for concrete forms and had some sort of trouble with every single sheet. We only used this stuff for "one or two ofs" that didn't need a perfect finish and then cut it up and burnt it. A lot of body filler was required. I wouldn't use it for anything that I wanted to look good over time. Marine grade DF might be slightly better quality, but I wouldn't bet on it. At this point, it looks like the plywood cost differential from DF to Meranti for my Zip project will be about $170 CDN. Comparing that to the overall cost, I think I'll spend the money.
Blair

to be strait....i wouldnt be using DF to save money...i would be using it because it is what my bill of materials calls for. Of course, i do think my bill of materials was written in the 50's so it looks like i can probably safely look at other options.

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Built the 17' Glen-L "Sea Knight"

I will go along with good materials are fun to work with. I like Meranti ply.

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Carl
If not now......When?
http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj94/gashog7/boat/
http://www.epoxyworks.com/26/index.html Number26

I built my Sea Knight with marine Meranti 5-ply. Good stuff. I emailed Glen-L at the time ('99) and asked...they said the Meranti or Okume would both be better than DF. $64/4X8 sheet at the time locally. My frames and chines are mahogany, the sheers are spruce.

does the meranti work well for the transom and frame gussets as well?
Thanks!

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Built the 17' Glen-L "Sea Knight"