Fuel return

About inboard or outboard motors.

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TomB
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Fuel return

Post by TomB » Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:24 am

The supplier tells me the PCM Ex343 engine has a 3/8” fuel return…No problem, I’ll just get a fuel tank with a 3/8” supply and return…Not so fast...that’s a custom tank (read expensive). The supplier suggested using a short length of pipe cut into the fill hose, drilled and taped for a 3/8 hose barb...Not so fast...the Coast Guard says the pipe has to be ribbed/barbed too.

This is what I found. It might not be the only answer, but it's the one I'm using.

www.fillernecksupply.com/1-1-2-auxiliar ... 5-dz97960/

Tom

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Bill Edmundson
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Re: Fuel return

Post by Bill Edmundson » Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:51 am

Tom

Try RDS. http://www.rdsaluminum.com/marine-stock-below.html I bought 1 stock tank and 2 custom tanks. The custom tanks were not out of line pricewise. These have pick-up and return connections.

Bill
Mini -Tug, KH Tahoe 19 & Bartender 24 - There can be no miracle recoveries without first screwing up.
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TomB
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Re: Fuel return

Post by TomB » Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:32 am

Thanks Bill,

Too late for me, I bought a Moeller tank (not sure what boat it was designed for) from www.greatlakesskipper.com. It was about $150 for a 33-gallon tank with dimensions similar to design dimensions. The guys at one of my local wooden boat build shops use www.SPEEDYTANKS.com . They quoted $500 for a 39-gallon aluminum tank (return extra).

Tom

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Mr Hot Rod
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Re: Fuel return

Post by Mr Hot Rod » Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:25 am

Tom

The link you supplied is intended for diesel fuel only. See WARNING in the part specs.

Here's another link : Fuel System References
Hope this helps !

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Last edited by Mr Hot Rod on Sun Mar 17, 2019 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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kens
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Re: Fuel return

Post by kens » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:13 am

We should have a sticky for this.
There is 8 different applicable and good links of info in this short thread.
Do we have a forum page of useful links & suppliers???
Oak is over rated, everything about it takes extra time; then it warps, splits or checks !!! :roll:

TomB
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Re: Fuel return

Post by TomB » Sun Mar 17, 2019 10:35 am

Thanks Paul,

I was looking at Subpart J, Figure 17, page 38...and missed the exception. The note in Figure 26, page 68 removes all question "Fuel tank fill pipe connections may be made with smooth pipe."

My plastic tank fill is 1 1/2", my fill hose is 1 1/2" too and I assume the deck fill will be 1 1/2" when the time comes. Is a 1 1/2" fill hose too small?
IMG_0313.jpg
This is a good fit for the plumbing I have and I will ask them if it is ok for gasoline, assuming not, why not.

There are two spots (that I can see) that may be a problem, the material used to seal the threads, and the little ball stop inside the brass fitting to slow fuel flow in a roll over. Worst case, could I take it apart, saw off the bit that shows inside the tube including the ball stop and put it back together with the correct sealer? What else am I missing?

Does this piece need to be grounded?

Thanks again,

Tom

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Mr Hot Rod
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Re: Fuel return

Post by Mr Hot Rod » Sun Mar 17, 2019 12:16 pm

kens wrote:Do we have a forum page of useful links & suppliers???
Hi Ken ! See Where to Find Information & Free Resources in the Forum Support Knowledge Base

This topic could be linked to the Support Knowledge Base threads. They contain solutions to many common questions. Thanks to Gayle and the moderators for setting this up. We now have a dynamic query-based Support Knowledge Base ! 8)

... As for grounding :
Each metallic component of the fuel fill system and fuel tank which is in contact with fuel must be statically grounded so that the resistance between the ground and each metallic component of the fuel fill system and fuel tank is less than 100 ohms.

Grounding or bonding may be accomplished by connecting the metallic components electrically by running a wire from one component to the next, and so forth to the boat’s ground. Grounding can usually be accomplished by a connection to the common bonding conductor or the engine negative terminal.

Source : uscgboating.org - Grounding
Try a Forum Search with the search term 'fuel tank grounding'. Here's a Direct link : Fuel tank grounding

I've added a few more links in my previous post. More reading !

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Last edited by Mr Hot Rod on Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TomB
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Re: Fuel return

Post by TomB » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:21 pm

Sorry for the remedial electrical question...How would one bond a wire to the fitting shown in Paul's post above?

Tom

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Mr Hot Rod
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Re: Fuel return

Post by Mr Hot Rod » Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:45 pm

Tom

Click on the Fuel Tank Grounding link in my last post. Onplane and Soloboat's posts had some great advice on this topic !

The Forum Search Tool (Quick Links Menu and Forum Search Box at top of the screen) will return search term matches from many topics. You may end up with a bit of reading to resolve your question ...

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Paul Kane
Kane Custom Boats Ltd.
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Building the Glen-L Hot Rod : http://www.kanecustomboats.com
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TomB
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Re: Fuel return

Post by TomB » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:46 am

I am grateful for the homework assignment. An arrow pointing at the Coast Guard Reg is very helpful. And I've read the posts suggested along with others.

My question isn't about what gets bonded, why, or what gauge conductor, it's a how question. Generally I would look for a way to create some kind of bolted connection that will not come loose, like on a metal fuel tank or metal deck fill. In this case, a wire needs to join a piece of pipe. My question is about how to do the joining, drill and tap for a green screw? braze on a stud for a nut? wrap a bare wire around three times with a square knot? :roll:

Thanks for everyone's patience,

Tom

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Mr Hot Rod
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Re: Fuel return

Post by Mr Hot Rod » Mon Mar 18, 2019 10:37 am

Sorry if I didn't explain this well enough.

The link I gave you Fuel Tank Grounding is a very indirect way to find what you're looking for.
This searches the Forums to find pertinent content. You may have to scan the returned topics to find the specific answer to your question.
I understand that your question isn't about what gets bonded, why, or what gauge conductor, it's a how question. In this particular case, it shares knowldedge culled from many topics on the Forum. If you can't find an answer to your question, you will have to search other sources or wait until someone posts a direct answer.

Here are a few more Search Tool usage tips :
  • The link returns a list of topics matching your search criteria.
    Read through the list and find the post which you would like to investigate.
    - To see all posts in a thread, click on the Post Title.
    - To see a specific post, click on the Jump to post > link in the post's bottom right hand corner.
_____________________________________________________________________________

You might have missed it, as it's pretty subtle ...
Here's a sreenshot :
Re: Grounding Fuel Fill and Fuel Tank (by Soloboat)
Using a through bolt to the underside to attach a ground wire is the way to go. I did just that however just make sure that there is continuity from fill to your ground verify by using an ohm meter. Connecting to a neg. bus is ok too.
Jump to post >
- To see all posts in a thread, click on the Post Title.
- To see a specific post, click on the Jump to post > link in the post's bottom right hand corner.
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Kane Custom Boats Ltd.
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Building the Glen-L Hot Rod : http://www.kanecustomboats.com
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Last edited by Mr Hot Rod on Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

TomB
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Re: Fuel return

Post by TomB » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:19 am

Sorry Paul, I think we're separated by a common language.

Bonding the fuel fill - no problem. Bonding the tank -no problem. Bonding anything with a threaded fastener or electrical connector - no problem. Even bonding building columns in my previous life - no problem. Going through past posts all the way back to dug out canoes or Google searches - no problem.

Getting a wire to somehow stay put on a Moroso EFI Fuel Injection Conversion Fuel Return Line Kit 65385 - Problem. Drilling a hole in it so I can plug the hole with a screw seems like creating a likely problem to avoid the improbable spark. Simply wrapping it with bare copper wire seems ineffective and probably corrosive. How do you get a wire to stick to the outside of a 3" long bit of pipe? I don't mean to put Paul on the spot, advice from anywhere would appreciated, but that's the question.

Tom

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Mr Hot Rod
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Re: Fuel return

Post by Mr Hot Rod » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:53 am

My apologies ! You're adding an extra part in the fuel fill system.

Try welding a grounding lug to the EFI fill tube fitting and bolt your ground to it. Ground from fuel fill cap, EFI fitting, ground lug on fuel tank.
All connections are bolted.

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Paul Kane
Kane Custom Boats Ltd.
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Building the Glen-L Hot Rod : http://www.kanecustomboats.com
Glen-L Hot Rod build thread
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TomB
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Re: Fuel return

Post by TomB » Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:53 pm

Mr Hot Rod wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:53 am
Try welding a grounding lug to the EFI fill tube fitting and bolt your ground to it. Ground from fuel fill cap, EFI fitting, ground lug on fuel tank.
All connections are bolted.
Thanks Paul, plastic tank in my case so the ground on the sender (I think). Welding a ground lug to the EFI tube...UGH...but I know a guy that can do the job. :D

Thanks for sticking with it.

Tom

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Re: Fuel return

Post by Mr Hot Rod » Mon Mar 18, 2019 2:24 pm

I'm not too keen on pumping fuel at high pressure in the filler tube ...

Refer to Denon Osterman's Plumbing twin tanks for EFI ? thread.

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Paul Kane
Kane Custom Boats Ltd.
Chelsea, Quebec

Building the Glen-L Hot Rod : http://www.kanecustomboats.com
Glen-L Hot Rod build thread
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