Building a Squirt

BarnacleMike · **Posted:** Fri Nov 04, 2011 6:18 am

Roberta, that's what I was thinking originally. I've planned from the beginning that I'd encapsulate everything. I also looked very carefully to find vertical grain in the boards I've bought so far. Another part of the equation is that this boat will be kept in the garage, not docked or in a slip. Its "real-time" exposure to water will only be a few hours at a time... perhaps overnight on a few occasions at the most.

JPrice, the mahogany I've found locally was $7.00 per board foot.

Iggy · **Posted:** Fri Nov 04, 2011 6:56 am

Another 'mahogany' family lumber that might do the trick is Khaya.

Both Sapelle and Khaya are 'relatives' to the 'authentic' honduran mahogany that typically fetches a very high premium as its in very low supply.

Douglas fir is also another option for framing. Harder to bend and tool, but very strong and rot resistant.

Its funny, Southern Yellow Pine is probably more expensive up here where I am than mahogany. If its local, and you get a big selection you can find where you can pick-out boards with the right grain direction and work around the knots, I'd be tempted to spend a bit of time trying that first.

jprice · **Posted:** Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:25 am

BarnacleMike wrote:

JPrice, the mahogany I've found locally was $7.00 per board foot.

Wow. If they're charging you something similar for white oak, then it sounds like a big rip off.

jprice · **Posted:** Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:37 am

I just took a look at the squirt BOM, and they also list spruce as an acceptable wood.
Kinda surprises me a bit, because I wouldn't think it would be well suited to a marine application. But what do I know.

You can probably get spruce for a heck of a lot cheaper than either mahogany or white oak.

Mr Hot Rod · **Posted:** Fri Nov 04, 2011 9:34 am

There's a very important little clarification in the Lumber section of the BOM which states that Spruce refers to Sitka spruce and is used when minimum weight is desired.

Quote:

LUMBER: All lumber noted allows length for fitting. All widths are actual size. All thicknesses are standard finished sizes, with 1" lumber being four quarters material, usually finished about 3/4". Where the lumber types listed are not available, suitable marine lumber can be substituted, including select Douglas-fir or long-leaf yellow pine, with dense straight grain. Other materials can be used if they have been used with successful results in your locality. Oak refers to white oak (red oak being more subject to rot). Mahogany refers to African, Honduras, or Phillipine-dark red varieties. Spruce refers to Sitka spruce and is used when minimum weight is desired. Plywood must be either marine or exterior grades, interior grade is not acceptable.

Reference: Squirt BOM

Other types of Spruce aren't recommended for boatbuilding :

Quote:

SPRUCE, ENGELMANN
(white spruce, Arizona spruce, silver spruce, balsam, mountain spruce)
23 lbs. per cubic foot, 1.92 lbs. per board foot
These varieties are described only to avoid confusion with the Sitka type of spruce. Grown mainly in the Rocky Mountain states, they are not suited to boat use due to softness, low strength, low resistance to decay, and lack of shock resistance. The sapwood and heartwood are hard to differentiate, and the wood is nearly white in color. It can be used in non-structural joinerywork, however, if not subjected to moisture.

SPRUCE, SITKA 28 lbs. per cubic foot, 2.33 lbs. per board foot
Grows along the Pacific Coast from Alaska to California. Because the trees grow tall, and the material is exceptionally strong for its weight, it is the ideal spar building lumber, even though rot resistance is low. The wood shrinks little and is moderately strong in bending. The heartwood is light pinkish brown and the sapwood creamy white. Where lightweight and strength are important, it is ideal.

Reference : Chapter 5 - Lumber from "Boatbuilding with Plywood" by Glen-L Witt

More Lumber info here : Chapter 5 - Lumber from "Boatbuilding with Plywood" by Glen-L Witt

__________________
Paul Kane Chelsea, PQ

Building the Glen-L Hot Rod : http://www.boats.chelseacoachworks.com

pamelalynne1 · **Joined:** Thu Jul 29, 2010 3:55 pm **Posts:** 354

I used white oak for frames and mahogany for longitudinals and stringers on my squirt build. I built a jet drive with a 550 Kawasaki. I went with all white oak for my Stiletto. I also used Philippine mahogany for the interior trim.

Attachment:

I still don't have that cleat for the stern I may have to reorder it.jpg [ 2.38 MiB | Viewed 852 times ]

Oak is about $3.25 per bd ft and mahogany is $4.99. Some lumber yards are as much as $6.50 for the mahogany. I priced sitka spruce and it was closer to $8.00. Of course, I live in NY and it has to come 3000 miles.

jprice · **Posted:** Fri Nov 04, 2011 11:45 am

That's some good info about the spuce.

Personally, I'd be concerned about buying the wrong one. You'd have to be very good at identifying it, or know a lumberyard you can really trust.

jeffh · **Posted:** Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:52 pm

Welcome to the forum Mike. There are 7 or more Glen-L boat owners in GA. One guy Bulldog Boater has three or is that four Glen-L boats now. More importantly, we all have to drive right by you to get to the Glen-L Gatherings on Nickajack Lake and the TN River.

DanaOverall · **Joined:** Wed Jan 06, 2010 7:55 am **Posts:** 58

jprice wrote:

That's some good info about the spuce.

Personally, I'd be concerned about buying the wrong one. You'd have to be very good at identifying it, or know a lumberyard you can really trust.

For anyone looking at buying Sitka (it's expensive), look at http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/w ... rstock.php . Sitka is using extensively in wing spar construction.

BulldogBoater · **Posted:** Sun Nov 06, 2011 9:54 pm

I bought African Mahogany at Suwanee Lumber just outside Atlanta three weeks ago at $4.20/ft. They keep a pretty good stock on hand but if you want to get a bunch of it all at once, I wood call first to check.

KB

Trilody · **Posted:** Mon Nov 07, 2011 1:34 pm

Hey BarnacleMike,

Welcome to the "boat building bug" or is that "club"?

I read your thoughts and questions about what wood to select etc. and felt the need to weigh in and share my experience.

I hear you on the issue of budget. Good marine grade plywood and lumber IS very expensive. In the long run, I think it's the right way to go, though. You don't necessarily have to buy it all at once. The build is going to take you a while and so spreading the purchases out over time is the way to go. The total might be more, if there's shipping each time, but at least it's more manageable than a big bill up front.

Then there's the resale of the finished boat, if your "bug" takes you to a new build. A boat built from quality materials will sell at a much better price. It's a degree of speculation on my part, but if workmanship, hardware, motor, systems, the market etc are all equal, then a Squirt built with marine grade ply and lumber would be able to add $1,000 to the sale price and possibly more.

If the idea of selling your future treasure is completely out of the question and I've offended you, then having built your boat from marine grade ply and mahogany, you'll know that you'll get many more years of use out of it before you need to do major overhauls.

I hope this helps in your decision, but first off what ever you do, conserve your money by spending it when you need the materials. It's going to take a while to build anyway.

Good luck and have a blast building.

Incidentally, the best set of step-by-step pics that I've found for the Squirt build belongs to Jeff Cobb:

http://jeffshomemadeboat.zoomshare.com/0.html

Cheers,

Richard

BarnacleMike · **Posted:** Mon Nov 07, 2011 2:44 pm

Richard,

You make a valid point. Thank you for your insight.

I did indeed find Jeff Cobb's photos to be a great inspiration. Art Atkinson's boat-building blog is fantastic as well:

http://artatkinson.blogspot.com/

BarnacleMike · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 12:03 pm

I've got a few more pieces cut for Frame #2 and have come to my next question:

The two bottom frame members are supposed to butt-up against the back section of the stem, which passes between them. How are these frame pieces actually affixed to the stem? I wouldn't think that screws should be driven diagonally through the frame pieces into the stem, but perhaps I'm wrong.

pamelalynne1 · **Joined:** Thu Jul 29, 2010 3:55 pm **Posts:** 354

The two frame pieces are joined together with a floor beam wich is, in turn, glued and screwed into the aft end of the stem with four screws. If epoxied properly it will hold uite well. And with the chines, sheers, bottom and deck battens will be rigid and strong. If you are concerned about strength you could use solid oak or mahogany in lieu of plywood for the stem. I did this on my Stiletto.

BarnacleMike · **Posted:** Thu Nov 10, 2011 10:02 am

Okay... I've seen the floor beam you mentioned in a couple of photos. So, I think I understand: the aft part of the stem passes between the two bottom frame pieces, and butts up against the floor beam. Is that right?

If the stem is made from two 3/4" pieces of plywood laminated together, wouldn't that mean that the screws that connect the floor beam to the aft end of the stem would thread into the end grain of the stem? I thought you weren't supposed to thread into end grain... ?

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