To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

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Bluesman
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To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Bluesman » Sat Jan 18, 2020 10:37 am

Tahoe - 21' - Period correct where possible

Pardon me for channeling William but I've seen this go both ways.
1) I like the look of the stainless on the bow
2) I believe it protects the point of the bow
3) I'd like it to follow down below the water line But I'm concerned about the "Glen-L Step" at the Chine.
4) I'm concerned about getting the fit right.

Pros & Cons? You're expert opinions are appreciated...
LeClaire, IA - Birthplace of "Buffalo" Bill Cody and home of the American Pickers on The History Channel

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Roberta
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Roberta » Sat Jan 18, 2020 12:27 pm

I think the juncture of the stem and chine should be faired smoothly providing a flat surface for the cut water.

Roberta
Roberta "Queen of the Boat Builders"
Built Zip "Oliver IV", Super Spartan "Jimmy 70", and Torpedo "The Glen L".

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Bluesman
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Bluesman » Sat Jan 18, 2020 12:51 pm

That is my thought and I'm at that stage right now. Still, just wondering about getting a nice fit..

I wish I could weld stainless. :?
LeClaire, IA - Birthplace of "Buffalo" Bill Cody and home of the American Pickers on The History Channel

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Roberta
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Roberta » Sat Jan 18, 2020 1:06 pm

Yup, the first 2 or 3 inches out from the leading edge of the stem will be very vertical from the bottom planking to the side planking. Fairing that prior to planking will give you a nice transition for the cut water.

Roberta
Roberta "Queen of the Boat Builders"
Built Zip "Oliver IV", Super Spartan "Jimmy 70", and Torpedo "The Glen L".

TomB
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by TomB » Sat Jan 18, 2020 2:03 pm

Ted,

I wove the planking layers at the bow so there is a smooth transition for the first 4" at the bow (2 3/4" is the minimum width for one cutwater guy). If you have a chine line to the stem after the sub-layers you could fair it smooth and then cover with the veneer.

Two other vintage approaches to consider -

Some brought bottom paint above the waterline as the chine left the water. If you did that you could glass the bottom and rely on it to protect the edge near the water.

For a while, ChrisCraft left a flat surface on the leading edge of the stem and then used a narrow bit of plated brass to cover it. Using a narrow rub rail would give the same look.

Two other cutwater thoughts before veneer planking.

The cutwater guys don't seem to like a concave curve on the leading edge of the stem between the sheer and the chine. I have about a 1/4" and one guy grumbled about it.
IMG_0464.jpg
IMG_0463.jpg
How will you hide the top edge of the cutwater? Again referring back to some of the ChrisCrafts, the sheer was left an 1/8" proud of the hull at the stem and then faired back to 0" proud in the first 18" so the cutwater stopped at the bottom of the sheer and they could do what they wanted with rub rails, etc. (invisible unless you're looking for it).

Tom

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Bluesman
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Bluesman » Sat Jan 18, 2020 2:18 pm

My plan is to overhang the deck at the bow and bring the cutwater up under that. I'll use SS rub rails mating up on each side.

And some kind of a bow handle / cleat, etc... I'll know it when I find it I think!
LeClaire, IA - Birthplace of "Buffalo" Bill Cody and home of the American Pickers on The History Channel

TomB
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by TomB » Sat Jan 18, 2020 2:47 pm

I'm fond of the fairlead approach to bow caps, something like this Riva.
wooden-Riva-classic-boat-foredeck.jpg 550×412 pixels.jpg
Tom

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Andy Garrett
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Andy Garrett » Sat Jan 18, 2020 3:58 pm

"Glen-L step"

Never heard that one before.
Is this suggesting that Glen-L craft do not have a smooth transition at the chine near the stem? I wasn't aware they had a reputation for this characteristic.
Andy Garrett

Perhaps the slowest Zip build in Glen-L history...

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Bluesman
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Bluesman » Sat Jan 18, 2020 8:39 pm

That's just me being me.... Thinking of the Hillary Step.

There are 3 layers on the bottom and 2 on the sides, thus where they meet at the chine in the forward frames up to the bow there is a noticeable step, ledge, hump, whatever you want to call it. Fairing is the answer, but don't go too far with it.
LeClaire, IA - Birthplace of "Buffalo" Bill Cody and home of the American Pickers on The History Channel

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kens
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by kens » Sun Jan 19, 2020 6:21 am

Bluesman wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 8:39 pm
That's just me being me.... Thinking of the Hillary Step.

There are 3 layers on the bottom and 2 on the sides, thus where they meet at the chine in the forward frames up to the bow there is a noticeable step, ledge, hump, whatever you want to call it. Fairing is the answer, but don't go too far with it.
A lot of builders leave the step there, and that is where the chine spray rail goes.....
Oak is over rated, everything about it takes extra time; then it warps, splits or checks !!! :roll:

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Bluesman
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Bluesman » Sun Jan 19, 2020 7:41 am

Yes, I will be installing the spray rail and I have faired off the step at the stem about 3 inches back on both sides.
LeClaire, IA - Birthplace of "Buffalo" Bill Cody and home of the American Pickers on The History Channel

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Jimbob
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Jimbob » Sun Jan 19, 2020 11:09 am

I got my cutwater from cutwaters by mike. I had a hump at the chine at the transposition point on my barrelback. Mike said that the cutwaters are somewhat flexible, but you don't want the "hump" to be too pronounced at the chine. Mine was pretty noticeable, so I faired the plywood down before putting on the final mahogany planking. Mike sent me a pattern from an original barrelback which I used to determine how far to go below the waterline, and the the width at different points. You might be able to find a reproduction fairleader that would fit your boat. Make sure you get a tracing of the fairleader to see if it will fit your boat. The reproduction that I got, didn't match the angles of my breasthook, so I got a larger fairleader and had it modified to match a pattern of my bow. After the modification was made, I had it plated. I still have my original fairleader. I would be glad to send you a tracing of it so you could see if it would fit on your boat. I got my fairleaders from california classic boats.
Jim
Attachments
Another shot of the fairleader
Another shot of the fairleader
Here you can see it doesn't fit. Original boats were more pointed at the bow.
Here you can see it doesn't fit. Original boats were more pointed at the bow.
Fairleader lip goes over the top of the cutwater. Width of the cutwater varies like the original boats.
Fairleader lip goes over the top of the cutwater. Width of the cutwater varies like the original boats.
Jim Neeley
Building a Barrelback in Sacramento, CA
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=28089#p172969

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Bluesman
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Re: To cutwater... Or not to cutwater... That is the question

Post by Bluesman » Sun Jan 19, 2020 12:37 pm

Thanks and good info. I'll let you know about the fairleader once I get to that point. Ways to go still...
LeClaire, IA - Birthplace of "Buffalo" Bill Cody and home of the American Pickers on The History Channel

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