Alternative Fuels

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thudpucker
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by thudpucker »

there is a Bio-fuel that wont break us. Algae Diesel.

My Post Toasties cost a bunch more now that Corn is going into biofuel.

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DaveLott
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by DaveLott »

Interestingly, Thud, there was an article recently released about a project in S. Spain as a consortium between several countries and ExxonMobil. They have perfected an algae farm that uses the carbon dioxide byproduct of normal industry operations to create crude oil at a phenomenal rate. There goal was to reproduce in a rapid environment what nature takes millenium to produce. I believe I read that ExxonMobil contributed over $600M to the project alone.

Well, the article stated the figured it out. While I don't remember all the particulars I do recall one astonishing number. A 5000 acre farm would produce all the oil the US needs on a continuing basis!

The article stated that several test farms are being set up in the US right now. Let's see if this comes to fruition

dave
Dave

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thudpucker
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by thudpucker »

Dave,
I've spent two years on this project. Countless phone calls and Emails.
Ask any question of a Government official and you get the vague put-off. They dont know and dont know who would know! "Never heard of that...." is pretty common as well.

The Process is simple to understand.
Which Algae to start with?
You grow the Alga in a contained environment.
Harvest 40-50% of it.
Dry the water out of the Alga, recycle the water.
Squeeze the Dried Alga to get the 'soup' out.(note below)
Distill the Soup to remove the Lipids.(another note)
The Resulting oil can be burned in any Diesel.

Bio-diesel still has the Lipids so it needs more processing to use in a Diesel.

There is some Technology involved. When growing the Alga it must be protected from infusion, and thermally stable between the hi/lo limits.
The "Squeezing" and "Distilling" are the Dangerous parts.
(note below) Oil will combust if you heat and compress it too much.
(another note) There are two types of Distilling. Both are Volatile. I was told to find a Meth Cooker and pay him to do the Distilling.

I called the DOD. They are the worlds single largest user of Oil.
Surely somebody is looking for the next gallon of fuel eh?
Nope!
The DOD don't have anybody on staff doing the looking.
They depend on the Armed Forces etc to call them for a product. The PhD's (Vendors) ask the DOD for a grant to supply the product.
The DOD pays up front. The PhD's get to keep and sell the 'Intellectual Properties' and we have to buy from the PhD's.

With Algae Diesel there is a few places evaluating it right now for the DOD.
We cannot buy a fuel that wont work in all Temp's and Climates, so it's gonna be awhile before the DOD is actually using it on anything beyond a Test basis.

Beware! There are lot's of "Snake Oil" sales men out there. Saying: "Buy our book....etc"

I asked the DOD guy: "Since we Taxpayers are funding this research, why can't we own the IP for it?"
Naturally I got nowhere with that one.
I also asked for a Sketch of the process so a few thousand of us Diesel owners could get started....?
"There are a lot of us that would try it. The Vendors might be able to use our failures and success's as info on their efforts! We'll share if they will!"
Got nowhere with that one either.

I'm emotionally exhausted from trying to get any information or cooperation from our government. I dont trust anybody trying to sell me something.
I'll sure be interested in meeting with any guys who are also interested in Algae Diesel to see if we can make a dent in the Governments secrecy or our own efforts.
Dick

TX_Aggies
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by TX_Aggies »

"My friend is working on installation of a hydrogen generator for his car. He is good electrically and mechanically, so when he is finished it will have all the bells to make it work right. The article about hydrogen said you should be able to improve fuel efficiency 20 to 30%.

I will post how he does when he gets it installed and has results. He said it will cost about $100 for it."



Hydrogen is a miserable fuel to work with from an engineering & safety perspective.

If you're generating it and trying to store it under pressure, there is a phenomenon known as "hydrogen embrittlement". Turns an otherwise adequate pressurized tank into an explosion waiting to happen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_embrittlement

And if you're using electricity in water to generate then you actually lose energy in the transformation of water to hydrogen to mechanical energy. Far more efficient (read: cost effective) to use the electricity to drive a motor.
Try to build something that is idiot "proof" and you will simply expose a different group of idiots...

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kens
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by kens »

The article I saw on the algae process noted that the algae does produce oil, but, in order to produce the oil at a production rate.......it takes more power (electricity) to grow&harvest the algae in a 'temperature controlled' eviroment. All the airconditioning to grow the algae uses as much power as the oil you get from it.
Oak is over rated, everything about it takes extra time; then it warps, splits or checks !!! :roll:

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Bill E
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by Bill E »

That's still better than production ethanol, which uses way more power to produce than the power you get from burning the ethanol! Seems like a corn farmer's (lobbyist's) boondoggle, from what I've heard.
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upspirate

Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by upspirate »

I think I'll start restoring my sailboat!! :wink:

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thudpucker
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by thudpucker »

Compared to the Cost of Dino, Algae is pretty Cheap. The Israelis are making it work.
I was thinking of making enough Algeoleum to power a Generator which would run my plant electrically. That will ALMOST make Perpetual Motion a real thing.
I respect all you Engineers statements about the Cost to make the stuff. In a rising cost of fuel at the pump, the Cost of Mfg Algeoleum is no longer a prohibitive factor.

Back in WWII the Germans made "moo Juice" for fuel and Oil out of Coal.
Certainly we should be able to do the same.

The Beauty of Algae is the Reproduction of the Algae. You harvest 40% of it, and in a week that's re-grown to 100% again.
Compared to Corn which is a "Once a year Crop" or Sugar beets etc, Algae is way cheaper to generate and harvest.

The Energy cost to produce Oil is Tremendous. We WILL run out of Dino at some time. If we start to use other resources now, maybe we'll all have Oil forever.
Corn in fuel is bogus. Corn in your Cereal is real. :roll:

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leakcheck
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by leakcheck »

I don't know what all the fuss is about, lets drill drill drill and use up some oil!! My brother is only paying about 80 cents a gallon right now...oh yeah...he is in Quatar !!! :roll: :roll: :wink:

STeve

upspirate

Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by upspirate »

leakcheck wrote:I don't know what all the fuss is about, lets drill drill drill and use up some oil!! My brother is only paying about 80 cents a gallon right now...oh yeah...he is in Quatar !!! :roll: :roll: :wink:

STeve
I think I'd rather be here and pay $3.89 !!!! :wink: :roll: 8)

Oyster
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by Oyster »

leakcheck wrote:I don't know what all the fuss is about, lets drill drill drill and use up some oil!! My brother is only paying about 80 cents a gallon right now...oh yeah...he is in Quatar !!! :roll: :roll: :wink:

STeve
Sure that stands to reason. If you drive less the prices will come down. I wonder if the new alternative and true green energy plans on the horrizon include new camel dealers in the states too? :lol: :wink:

TX_Aggies
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by TX_Aggies »

We are the world's Saudi Arabia when it comes to natural gas reserves. Natural gas is easy to find, easy to extract, & available in quantities that could make us a net exporter of energy. Why would we not want to be free of the harsh yoke of OPEC?

Here is a pretty good web link with the advantages of using CNG:

http://www.cngnow.com/EN-US/Pages/default.aspx

I hate T. Boone Pickens (that's his website linked above) and hate that he would benefit from our exploiting domestic natural gas reserves, but when he's right he's right...
Try to build something that is idiot "proof" and you will simply expose a different group of idiots...

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thudpucker
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by thudpucker »

There are lot's of arguments against every conceivable alternative.

I want to hear from somebody that's made some Algae fuel at home and uses it on the road.
When we get that far, we can debate the relative costs involved.

But....when we are all capable of making our own fuel, you'll see the cost of Dino come down.
Also....we will be pulling the rug out from under Sheik AV Sheetma Drawers and easing the drain on our resources.

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DaveLott
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by DaveLott »

Wow, now that is interesting. All the links to the Spanish Scientist article are now dead links and the yahoo videos have dissappeared.

HMMMMM :?
Dave

Riviera build - the Midnight Cry Project
Glen-L Sea Kayak
Mahalo Standup Paddleboard

Video of Midnight in Action

Few things in the world measure up to the thrill and satisfaction of boating in a boat that you built.

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thudpucker
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Re: Alternative Fuels

Post by thudpucker »

There's a Company in Kentucky that has a big pond.
He has Alga on the surface. The Talapia fish feed on the drippings from the Alga.
He harvests part of the Alga continuously to make a Cake.
From the Cake (buyers) make Artificial sugar and etc.
Some of the Cake he processes for fuel which runs his operation.
Amazing thing to behold if it all works like he says it does. :mrgreen:

He's selling books on how to, but I'm pretty skeptical about some of his answers.

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