Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

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pamelalynne1
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Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by pamelalynne1 »

I have a repair job for a local boat owner who has a 1962 Penn Yan with splitting and damage to the outer keel. I have been reading several articles regarding whether or not to use fibreglass cloth to cover the entire bottom. I will be using thickened epoxy for fillets on the keel and plan to fill all cracks and cover the entire bottom with layup resin, at least three coats. He also wants the bottom painted with copper bottom paint, which he has already purchased. The argument against using cloth is that, if you need to service the bottom at a later date it is going to be nearly impossible if covered with cloth. Penn Yan was noted for their sealed hulls that didn't shrink or swell due to their laminating process. So, I believe moisture would not be an issue as the boat has also been out of the water and stored all winter. He does leave the boat in the water all season.

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DaveLott
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by DaveLott »

Ok, the purpose of applying cloth to the bottom is for wear, abrasion and damage control. Wood exposed with only a paint covering is easy to damage. A bottom covered in cloth is not so easy.
Caveat to that statement is that there are some very hard paints available that mitigate damage in most situations.

To give you an example, I have 2 bunks on trailer that created a wedge for the bow to ride up on . I was forced to drive my boat up on the trailer at a ramp that was being hit hard with whitecapping waves. The bunks dug into my bottom but only scrapped the paint off. The glass did not allow the bunks to dig into the wood. I am convinced that if I has only painted wood on the bottom that I would be doing some damage repair.

Regarding, repair. I wonder who tells you that fiberglassed bottoms cannot be repaired. You only need to go to any boat repair shop and see for yourself that they in fact can be repaired.

In following with the comments that followed: I am not suggesting glass over old wood.


The Penn Yan Lapstrakes are fine boats. Do you have some pics?
Last edited by DaveLott on Sun May 15, 2011 5:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
Dave

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Oyster
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by Oyster »

Aged boats needs to be repaired in a completely different manner. FIBERGLASS over older parts and targetting selected sections for upgrading with modern materials is by far the worse thing that you can do without looking elsewhere in the hull and see where age and fatigue has taken its toll.

FWIW, check this thread out. This event is and was probably is a classic example of short cutting a repair or neglecting the most basic reasons why older boats leak and areas become weakened and allow water to enter.

http://glen-l.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=12500

So if the boat has reached a point that sections are given the owner an issue, there is in almost all cases other areas ready for an upgrade too. We call it opening up a can of worms sometimes and this should not be overlooked. Those boats have never aged that well.

By some chance do you have any pictures. close up of the interior and bilge areas too? Frames? Keel? Dig a bit deeper for sure before you attempt to do what we call a "Mary Carter" job and have it come back to bite you.

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kens
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by kens »

I basically agree with Oyster. The part that got me was you mentioned using layup resin at least 3 coats. To me, the term layup resin describes polyester resin. I know of no person on this board that uses polyester resin on wood boats. We use epoxy for good reason.
Polyester on wood dont work.
Oak is over rated, everything about it takes extra time; then it warps, splits or checks !!! :roll:

upspirate

Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by upspirate »

Check these threads too from one of our members that thought it would be an easy restoration on a lapstrake boat:

http://thompsondockside.com/views/viewt ... ca1626c2ef

http://glen-l.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=5029

Also, polyester won't stick over epoxy filler from what I've heard

pamelalynne1
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by pamelalynne1 »

I mentioned layup resin as I am using a non blush epoxy resin from Aeromarine that does not need sanding between coats and can be layed one coat on another to the desired thickness. I told the boat owner that I would be checking the hull thoroughly inside and out for any sign of rot or other deterioration before I began work on the keel. I am certainly not taking anything for granted. I gave him a flat rate hourly price for the work. There is a slight hook in the bottom about which the owner is not concerned. It seems to be less than an inch in total. I'll check this in more detail when I turn the hull. This hull had been sitting on a roller trailer for several winters and now is on one central bunk and two multiple roller units, one on each side and about 4 feet long. I suggested replacing them with bunks at least 8 feet long. The hull is about 16 ft. My concern is not so much opening a can of worms as in sealing up the can with worms still in the can in case I might miss something, no matter how small. The entire hull does need paint and the upper sides and deck need varnishing; but the owner wants to do these areas himself. He was afraid to tackle the bottom. I have adequate space and equipment available to safely turn and support the hull whereas he does not.

upspirate

Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by upspirate »

Sorry,I hadn't seen any epoxy referred to as layup resin,that's where that misunderstanding came from

Well good luck to ya....at least from those threads you know what you may be in for in the job!!!

I love the old lapstrakes,but whew if you have to fix them!!! :shock: :roll: :wink: :?

pamelalynne1
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by pamelalynne1 »

Started on the Penn Yan repair today. Thoroughly inspected the hull adn found only on small secton on the outer keel with a soft spot. So, I am replacing the keel rather than repairing it. I stripped the entire bottom today and will be sanding, filling over some screws and then starting the fibreglassing. I'm not used to working 10 hour days anymore. :D

pamelalynne1
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by pamelalynne1 »

Here are a couple of pics of the Penn Yan repair in progress.
View from transom.jpg
Masking side planking.jpg

pamelalynne1
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by pamelalynne1 »

I didn't get my fibreglass until Monday, so I'm a day behind. Just put the second coat of resin on this morning. I did not remove the bilge drain but elected to cut the cloth and seal around it with resin..
Port side of bottom with new keel and fibreglass installed.jpg
Starboard side of bottom today.jpg

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DaveLott
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by DaveLott »

WOW, that is looking good

dave
Dave

Riviera build - the Midnight Cry Project
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pamelalynne1
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Re: Repairing old Penn Yan Lapstrake

Post by pamelalynne1 »

Finished the Penn Yan bottom repair today. Total hours 32.5 It is definitely easier to build new. :D
Saturday May 28th Three coats of piant..jpg
The customer wants to finish the topsides himself. I don't think he can afford me. :lol:

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