question on scooter boat build

Steel and aluminum boatbuilding. See: "Boatbuilding Methods", in left-hand column of the Home page, for information about alloys.

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twaite
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Sat Mar 19, 2016 4:07 pm

Build List: Storage and fish box

Question:

If I cut out sections of framing to insert storage/fish boxes and weld cut section of framing to these boxes would that be proper or is there another/better way to assemble them. (plan was to build a insert/drop in to sit top of the 4" high longs) hope this makes since.
Capt. Travis

Kevin Morin
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by Kevin Morin » Sat Mar 19, 2016 4:47 pm

Travis, a little while ago, I'd asked you to begin to consider below decks lockers and stowage in order to begin to see how those would impact your framing. We had a brief exchange- but now, it looks like you're seeing why that question was asked?

The main fore and aft longs on the two outer hulls would be cut down rather substantially if the locker were to intersect, so the bottom section of that portion of the Main Long may need to be beefed up? If the locker was 9" deep so it sat on the 2 4" longs? then some planning for that area of framing needs to be made- like adding another long or a pair on the flanks of the main? If we have a 14" tall beam and replace is with a 4" we'd best be able to recover the stiffness.

However, the locker itself is structural if you can get it to integrate to the rest of the structural framing by welding it in before the deck goes on. If you can weld it to the entire hull frame - then the Main Long is just changed in shape- not weakened in any way important.

So, pick the locker size- and plan where it will sit fore and aft, then see what types of joints you can make that will allow it to weld to the framing? (HINT) if you keyhole the bottom of the locker to the longs below the floor/bottom of the locker- you could air test those welds with the rest of the hull and the locker would be a 'dip' or recess in the deck's seal of the hull.

Will these lockers be insulated?

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
Kevin Morin

twaite
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Sat Mar 19, 2016 5:25 pm

Kevin,

Storage Lockers:

Yes sir, (continuing with my list as you requested)... I am working on that so I can include it with my drawings/build notes.. Trying to build the boat on paper with the assembly steps first as you suggested.

Lockers: ok that was my plan if added ( built in prior to decking) and frames were intersected/cut would be welded to them in their true location making it a part of the boat, bottom welded to 4" flanged longs.. just wanted to make sure it was proper.

Key hole: am I assuming right that you mean cutting holes to join the two parts together.. that is what I have seen on your other post...

Insulation/floatation:

Funny you should ask my next question,

I see a lot of builders use pour in floatation and I have read mixed reviews: Some say don't do it as it will get wet and eat through the aluminum as well as make it nearly impossible to repair if necessary: Some say its worth the piece of mind.. Whats your thoughts on this..
Capt. Travis

Kevin Morin
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by Kevin Morin » Sat Mar 19, 2016 7:14 pm

Travis, first the weld term 'keyhole'. The bottom of the lockers could be welded to the flanged/bent tops of the longs through holes in the bottom of the locker bottom panel so the bottom was attached well to the longs. Those welds would air test when the entire boat was tested.

The ends would butt to the cut out in the main full ht. long and with some planning and gusseting you'd be back to full stiffness.

Now to insulation- I didn't introduce the word flotation. I don't use foam for that purpose. I've done lots of articles on line, in many places, about that subject and some of the companion threads here will probably have my ranting about the subject too.

Let's go around the bush of flotation before I call the gum'mint regulators idiots- then I'll call them idiots. First how does flotation work? Flotation is some place/volume/compartment/locker/space inside the hull of a boat- that displaces water when the boat is full to the sheer. Let's say that another way- when the boat is awash to the gunwales- flotation is that space or volume that keeps water out. So... the result is the boat is NOT full of water, its only full to the sheer and some spaces are reserved.

The reserve spaces have to keep water out that weighs the same amount as the hull and gear of the boat. IF the spaces did not keep water out that weighed the same or more than the boat- it would sink when filled. OK so the purpose of flotation is a safety feature to keep the boat from sinking when it is full of water - that is full to the top of the sheer - or swamped - awash- filled- sunk.

Now, what is your boat like? Well its like a skiff or jon boat with no sides above the deck. So how exactly could your boat 'fill' with water? It would have to have a hole where water could come in and fill the bottom or sub deck volume. Let's look at that in real life. The 1/8" 5052 is about 22,000 psi tensile per square inch the boat weighs roughly 1,400 running and that implies at 15 to 20 mph you could get enough force up- wt. times speed to poke a hole in the boat. But what is it that will poke that hole? Well to "fail" or yield you'd have to hit something that was less than 1" in dia. and pointed to allow the force to concentrate to poke the hole. That also means the stake or puncturing steel obstruction has to hit the boat at exactly 90 to the bottom with the entire boat coming down directly onto the point- if it is glancing (as are 98% of marine impacts) then the angle of incidence applies to reduce the force of momentum.

If the angle is not perfectly 90, say it was 10 or 15 deg- the boat's speed (momentum) will have to be higher and higher to obtain the 'failure' point of that alloy. A Note: most 1/8" bottom jet sleds rake over rocks in our Alaskan rivers at 50mph and barely scrape the metal. So is a hole likely in a southern latitude beach; not so much.

Now, lets look at the beach rocks or pier and pilings and river rocks and all the underwater obstructions around your neck of the woods. Which one is a pointed steel bar? Next, what happens when aluminum 5052 is impacted - well it has about 40% elongation factor (how much is stretches before it tears or fails) and as (that) aluminum works/stretches its tensile rises about 38% rough number.

What does that mean to the boat bottom? IF your boat is 5052 it means as the sharp steel stake is rammed at exactly 90 deg's into the bottom the bottom's tensile or 'yield' strength will increase from 22,000psi to about 30,000 psi; so now, the boat has to speed UP, the stake of steel has to stay the same size, no bending- otherwise - the boat will bounce off with a dent but no hole.

Let's summarize why this boat and 99% of all welded aluminum alloy boats don't get many holes in them. At 20mph you'd have to hit a sharp stake of steel, then give it the throttle as the bottom hardened, and hope the waves would drop you straight down on the stake OR>.. you ain't putt'n no holes in this sled.

Back to flotation. If the bottom is not going to get a hole in this life time or your sons'- then what is the foam inside going to prevent? Nothing any rational human being can argue. Mind you this doesn't apply exactly to press and stretch formed Lunds, Gregors, Starcrafts, Trackers, and other thin riveted boats with different alloys. Not only do they not have welded voids, they're very thin, different alloys and have brittle spots all over them- and they'll last many lifetimes if treated with the slightest amount of care- what does that say about your 1/8" hull?

Last, what do you do and all other builders do to make sure all the welds are 'tight' - we air test the boat's air voids to make sure the integrity of all the welds is tight. IF you pressure test a void for leaks, repair all pressure leaks with a TIG torch; or cut out the MIG problem and replace as strip of weld then retest??? the entire boat will be an air tight tank. Then it will be vented to allow air in and out all day long as temp swings.

What on earth does the foam do? Answer: The small size metal boat market is 98% non welded- they are formed boats and don't have welded in sealed chambers. Therefore, if you want safety for a 18' riveted boat from Lund et al - foam blocks under the seats make good sense. Should that include welded boats with their air tested voids? If the voids volume is sufficient to displace the wt of the water trapped by the topsides in the 'awash' condition- OK fine the boat is as safe as it will be. (but) The reg.s actually say you have to "vent the voids" and pull the plug so that foam HAS to be used in boats under 20' LOA.

I've hears some people say- " I don't test the welds, I add foam" and right there you all about their boat building skills. If the welds are tested anyway- why put in foam? If they're not tested the foam will promote two different kinds of corrosion, detailed on the other threads.

I say the reg.s are irrational to included properly built welded plate boats with the riveted products, but I don't write regulations. However, I do build boats with "nitrogen filled, sealed, box beams; that cannot be vented without sacrificing their structural integrity". Besides the regulations are mainly for manufacturers or firms building lots of boats- not us 'backyard boat builders' as we're described.

I asked if you're planning to insulate the fish boxes before I draw them for you? They have to be designed and built differently than bare boxes. Pls give dimensions and I'll draw some lockers and indicate if they're insulated- remember even insulated aluminum conducts heat like wildfire so they won't be even 1/5th as good a common plastic cooler for the same job.

Did you tell me if you have a TIG torch and know how to use it?

Sorry to rant... foam in welded aluminum boats is a joke, an expense to put in, assured deterioration of the boat, and a super pain to dry or clean if there is ever need to work on the boat's bilge or sealed spaces.

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
Kevin Morin

twaite
Posts: 129
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:38 am

Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Sat Mar 19, 2016 8:01 pm

Kevin,

I came to the same conclusion and couldn't agree more on floatation.... great post..

Lockers: dimensions not in stone if need be adjusted

2' x 3' forward deck (fish box, storage) insulated
2' x'6' P and S sides mid deck (uninsulated)

I planned on having above deck Live well/seat forward of console and storage locker above deck located behind lean post (life jackets ect.)

I no longer have a TIG TORCH..

Thanks,
Capt. Travis

twaite
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:06 am

Kevin,

Deck Layout:

Here is my first run at the deck layout, sorry for the watermark as I used the free version to draw... Wanted to see what you thought.. I don't have a problem with resizing or moving anything for structual and or functional purposes just trying to get an idea of space and stability.

I tried to keep the locker sizes to accommodate the framing schedule, not sure how I did but I gave it a shot... side lockers are shown as 15" x 4' but can be 6' as the depth will be minimum..
first run layout.jpg
Capt. Travis

twaite
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:51 am

Deck Layout:

Raised Console platform: (image is for reference only and is not to size for this built)
raised console design.jpg
Space for cooler under lean post

Cooler/seat forward console:
cooler seat example.jpg
Capt. Travis

Kevin Morin
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Location: Kenai, Alaska

Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by Kevin Morin » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:03 am

Travis, I'm tied up for a few days longer, so no drawing time to spare yet.

I did look at arrangement plan view and wondered what is in a 38"x38" console? Are you putting a head in there? The fuel tank on deck is understandable, keep it low and centralized make sense.

The bow locker looks ill thought out? The bow is ramping/sweeping/slopeing up at that point- total locker depth - 3"???? draw the cross section or look at your plans and see if a below decks locker, on centerline at the bow makes any sense given the cross section? Maybe a raised deck section added above the bow I've drawn makes this area deeper - and I'm not aware of it?

Last, I'd look to see if the leaning post, and console could be explored more thoroughly before spending time drawing. I saw the example photos and they help but I'd need a bit more explanation as to how each item relates to your build before drawing.

back in a few days when life settles back down in my neighborhood.

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
Kevin Morin

twaite
Posts: 129
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Tue Mar 22, 2016 4:57 pm

Kevin ,

Sounds good...

Control Console: Found this one I like
Dimensions: 22L x 23W x 32H

Lockers: Forward Locker (Bow)
The forward chine curve starts 5' from bow. At 4' from Bow I am showing 6" from deck to tunnel panel without raised deck. with the 4' x 4" raised deck that would give me approx. 6" deep locker (6" from tunnel to deck 4" raised platform - 4" long = 6" locker)
Plans show raised deck (3' x beam width x 4") I think a 4' x Beam width x 4" would great and still accommodate a wheel chair...

Lean post: I think these dimension would fit the boat well
Dimensions:
15 3/8 footprint
28 wide (seat)
30 tall

Cooler seat: 72 qt 29.5" L x 16.5" W x 16.13" H (Mounted forward Console)

Fuel tank: 25 gal.
Dimensions: 47" L x 18-1/32" W x 7-1/2" H

So if I am figuring correctly that makes the Raised Console platform
Dimension: 30"w x 84"L by 12" off deck (to accommodate fuel tank) will also leave 3' x 30" x 12" open area under raised console platform for additional storage possibilities.
Capt. Travis

Kevin Morin
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by Kevin Morin » Tue Mar 22, 2016 10:07 pm

Travis, I"m not sure I'm all on board with all the details?

I'd build the fuel cell so it was a deck of its 'ownself'. I'd make it the entire raised platform and stiffen the top to walk on then put the console and leaning post on that raised center deck/fuel cell. This makes one fab out of several- and holds more fuel; you need much more than 25 gallons don't you?

I think the raised foredeck is a good idea and allows both the forward locker and raised casting platform, not much metal because the total addition is the increase in sides, bow and tiny raised bulkhead aft.

Can I have a copy of the plans? I could probably be more helpful if I did, and if we make a new boat we'll leave the rights to the Site and they could do as they'd like. I'm sort of running blind without a set, I'll model her and make your mods, we'll post and agree on your design then we'll turn 'em over to Gayle to retain in the Book. Just take your camera/phone and shoot images from a fixed distance, at 90 deg, but close enough to see the scale markings and make sure the paper lays flat for a day or two first so we're not fighting any serious wrinkling and distortions. I'll get Glen-L the markups and all our drawing files so they have digital files and images and we'll include NC files if it matters on a design this "cubic" ?

What you have to agree to do- OR die trying!! is to post every single, cotton picking, chicken plucking, pea-picking step for the site's forum. Pictures AND text- that's nearly like building twice!- and you are on the hook for all that to Glen-L's Forum.

sorry to be impatient, on the run here for a few days.

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
Kevin Morin

twaite
Posts: 129
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:38 am

Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Wed Mar 23, 2016 3:05 am

Kevin,

That sounds awesome :D , I emailed Gale and will let you know the reply.. What a great opportunity for all, as the thread is nearing 8000 views there is a definite opportunity for Glen L especially with the new CNC for metal offering... Looking forward to this and I certainly agree to your request I am all in....

Regards,
Capt. Travis

Kevin Morin
Posts: 739
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 11:36 am
Location: Kenai, Alaska

Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by Kevin Morin » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:29 pm

Travis, I'm happy to help and note a few things for our 'deal'. First I'm not able to work all the hours of any day on one project so we won't be launching next weekend. Second and perhaps most important, we'll get some preliminary drawings/sketches up and then see what needs to be confirmed and make adjustments to the drawings as needed, but because of point #1 it won't be instantaneous, not always overnight sometimes days will pass and I'm not able to work on the design. We're working from a proven shape but converting it and adding all the deck hardware is going to take a bit of planning so I'm cautioning you on realism with respect to launch date: it always takes longer the first time than planned.

Some things we can continue to discuss effectively are the lockers, console and tank. What size tank is realistic for this boat? 25 gal seems small to me? The reason being the engine will soak that up in a couple hours at full throttle -right? I don't know the actual consumption but it must be 10-12gal/hr? So volume seems important to explore?

I'd say it was the best path to look first at volume- and 25 gal. may be adequate for your uses??? then move to implied size then to location/structure.

Next, my remark about lockers is that shallow lockers seem extremely expensive to build for what you'd get. If you're discussing lockers that are less than 10" or 12" deep- why bother? A locker will need a fully metal sided box lowered into the very shallow designed deck and hull framing structure. That operation alone is quite a bit of work, the material for a 6" deep locker is within a 4" flat bar of the same material for one nearly twice as deep. The labor is identical - for any stowage size regardless of depth but the result is very different when the lockers are so shallow.

The hatch, coaming, cover, deck plate of a 'walk-on' deck mounted locker is not like standing console cabinet so it takes some design and fab to end up with an enduring piece of the boat. The hatch coamings need to drain, that implies some decent TIG work (OR extraordinary MIG work) to get the coaming to drain overboard. Can't drain into the bilge they have to shed overboard- so there are some fixed design considerations for a series of deck mounted hatches and therefore making one or more shallow appears to be small return on you aluminum dollar and labor?

One last item to add to the design mix for hatches in the deck. Hatch covers in some cases may not be flush inlaid into the deck but can be raised up so there is no need for trough shaped recessed coaming. In these instances the hatch cover sits on top of a single vertical coaming around the opening- which is raised above deck level and the hatch cover's top is raised above the surrounding deck. This can be a trip hazard or a great simplification of work - all depending on where the hatch is located compared to the boat's layout.

For example, the entire foredeck could be covered with a pair of hatches and that entire area become accessible by swinging one or both up. This would make the foredeck design into a locker entirely above the rest of the deck. Just something to think about when considering the hatches and coamings versus the labor and materials needed to create stowage on a boat that is 'all deck'.

Consoles

Image
This sketch above, (may be a repeat post? ) shows the parts to a console method of design and building that allows the press brake to make all the parts. I'd have them sheared if you have access to a brake, there's usually a shear nearby? The parts' proportions can be adjusted to suit your design Travis. The console can be wider, taller, deeper.... just adjust the dimensions you give the shop that's shearing and braking.

With most sketches I mention the color is to show separate parts not to imply you follow my paint scheme. All parts can be a thin as you can weld, I make them of 0.080" or thicker because I can weld thinner material with the torches I have. The entire fabrication can be 1/8" and depending on the steering pump you use... I build a top reinforcing frame that BolTs under the top to stiffen that panel. When you stand up and drive a planing boat the wheel becomes the hand holds for the helmsman- and gets plenty of stress that would translate to the console top if not for a stiff reinforcing frame underneath. (not shown)

Image
In this progression from the first sketch the door coaming has been made by taking a press braked OR extruded angle 'picture frame' in dark gray and welding it to the inner most edge of the two flanges broken onto the inner edges of the console body. I lay the console on the bench and lean inside and weld that seam continuous and don't weld inside the recess it forms this leaves a nicely finished edge outside that can be lined with weather stripping to make a quiet non-rattling door on the console. Locking hardware can be added- or just a paddle type truck tool box handle in SS to latch the door to the coaming. A small bar welded to the inside of the angle coaming will hold the door latch tongue and is adjustable with a file or sander.

Image
This sketch of the top fitted to the bent console upright shows the working surface for helm pump, instruments but I usually include side housings for controls and cables. Depending on size of the controller (levers and base) and the top or side mount design, the control lever base can mount on top or on the side of the 'box' shown.

I prefer to TIG all this type of work because of the smaller welds needed, because of the additional control I get with that welding mode, and because I can weld and forget - skipping any type of finishing work that may be needed if the MIG welds are not visually appealing? On the other hand if the inside seams were backwelded or even back stitched well, and the outside welds were prepped carefully before MIG welding? then sanding off the MIG welds to obtain a nicer finish while still using MIG welding process would still result in an attractive console.

Image
Above, with the door on, is the completed concept console. I like to blind rivet the SS piano hinges (there are aluminum piano hinges too) to the side of the door, then to the inside of the flanged bent side of the vertical side of the coaming. This hides the hinge except the pin channel, putting both leaves inside the coaming and if the coaming depth/width is planned correctly this allows the door to open without interference on the latch side.

The door is a pan braked assembly and if needed- depending on thickness and size- can have a small X broken to stiffen the door that will hardly be noticeable on the finished door's outer side. On the other hand, if this type of door is not X brace broken, then, bars can be welded to the inner side if the door is subject to twist once the corners are welded closed? Once the hinge side is riveted there is not going to be much twist!

Image
This photo shows a console built exactly as the previous sketches illustrate. Here, the windscreen and the side hand rails are supports and grab railings are mounted to the top flat surface and some 'retro-looking', automotive inspired, 1950's inspired instrument housings and cowlings are cut into the deck. They're made from pieces of aluminum pipe with 'donuts' or mounting flats welded inside. A few button head, socket recess, SS cap screws are visible where the H shaped helm pump support is bolted into the console's top from below; to stiffen the top and recess the pump so the wheel is close to the console top and ht. adjusted for the Skipper.

The wind screen glass will mount in rubber so an entire piece of plate is used, and MIG welded out fully before the opening is cut for the glass.

The controller mount box is off to the side, #1 to clear the wheel from the T shift/throttle handle, #2 too keep the two cables out of the cabinet until they are well below the top and inner shelf &, #3 to keep the overall console narrower by a few inches and still have room for the controller as top mounted.

Image
This photo shows the windscreen glass cutout and you can make out the depth of the bends inside the console's body/hatch opening as shallow when compared to the sketches above. This depth is controlled by the dies both size and configuration for the press brake service you're working with to get your console bent. Travis it's important to make an effort to find out early what the limits of return and reach-in of your shop services are before you draw your plan view cross section.

Image
Console in the background of this photo of the crew of the fishing skiff. The T handle shift is just visible to the left of the Crew's red right arm sleeve- base is kind of obscured in the background shadow under the gunwale.

Travis, this console method can be adapted to what ever size or proportion of sizes that you choose. On your boat, I'd suggest considering a battery shelf inside (low as possible) to keep them out of the weather? Selecting the steering pump and any pressure tank hardware, if needed, and all other related items -now.. allow you to plan their mounting well in advance of any metal being bent. One key consideration is the wheel- its dia. vs the engine control lever's location- that needs to be tight but not interfere.

Hope this helps with your planning?

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai AK
Kevin Morin

twaite
Posts: 129
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:38 am

Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Wed Mar 23, 2016 4:00 pm

Kevin Morin wrote:Travis, I'm happy to help and note a few things for our 'deal'. First I'm not able to work all the hours of any day on one project so we won't be launching next weekend.
Kevin, I fully understand that we all have our lives beyond boat building and have the upmost respect for that... I have been at this for awhile now so I am in no rush to make a mess however I would like to have it built while I am able to enjoy it LOL... no rush easier on the finances and built/planned right... :D

Second and perhaps most important, we'll get some preliminary drawings/sketches up and then see what needs to be confirmed and make adjustments to the drawings as needed, but because of point #1 it won't be instantaneous, not always overnight sometimes days will pass and I'm not able to work on the design. We're working from a proven shape but converting it and adding all the deck hardware is going to take a bit of planning so I'm cautioning you on realism with respect to launch date: it always takes longer the first time than planned.

No problem, will try to take pics and post.. I must worn you my plans are plenty wrinkled and have a lot of markings on them.. I PM'd you on the option..

Some things we can continue to discuss effectively are the lockers, console and tank. What size tank is realistic for this boat? 25 gal seems small to me? The reason being the engine will soak that up in a couple hours at full throttle -right? I don't know the actual consumption but it must be 10-12gal/hr? So volume seems important to explore?

I'd say it was the best path to look first at volume- and 25 gal. may be adequate for your uses??? then move to implied size then to location/structure.

Fuel consumption: From my research, Yamaha 115 4 Stroke 2200 lbs flats boat
3500 rpm: 27.7 mph 3.9 gph 7.10 mpg
4000 rpm: 31.8 mph 5.1 gph 6.24 mpg
4500 rpm: 36.0 mph 6.4 gph 5.63 mpg

The majority of my fishing/ running will be within 5-10 mile max (most fishing drifting/anchored or flounder gigging air motor)



Next, my remark about lockers is that shallow lockers seem extremely expensive to build for what you'd get. If you're discussing lockers that are less than 10" or 12" deep- why bother? A locker will need a fully metal sided box lowered into the very shallow designed deck and hull framing structure. That operation alone is quite a bit of work, the material for a 6" deep locker is within a 4" flat bar of the same material for one nearly twice as deep. The labor is identical - for any stowage size regardless of depth but the result is very different when the lockers are so shallow.


Lockers are not a concern and can be all above deck that is not an issue for me at all. I can mount a cooler up front to haul fish no big deal... I do feel the raised platform is a great option and could make a great fit for general safety gear storage/anchor ect.... my main concern would be access to the bilge. I also agree with the raised lockers and had a boat with them forward and aft and never had an issue...



Consoles

Travis, this console method can be adapted to what ever size or proportion of sizes that you choose. On your boat, I'd suggest considering a battery shelf inside (low as possible) to keep them out of the weather? Selecting the steering pump and any pressure tank hardware, if needed, and all other related items -now.. allow you to plan their mounting well in advance of any metal being bent. One key consideration is the wheel- its dia. vs the engine control lever's location- that needs to be tight but not interfere.

Great looking console seems completely doable, makes perfect since and will fit the build well....

Hope this helps with your planning?

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai AK
Last edited by twaite on Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:29 am, edited 2 times in total.
Capt. Travis

twaite
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Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by twaite » Wed Mar 23, 2016 4:47 pm

Kevin,

I would prefer to use a preformed fuel tank as I am limited to Mig welding and I am in no means a pro at it nor would I ever claim to be... I would not feel comfortable building it as part of the console deck.. I feel comfortable with tubing square/round as far as consoles/platforms ect... plus I cant build one for what one cost.. as far as the tubing/pipe it is readily available and very reasonable here... I have all the cutting/forming tools here for that,, notcher/bender.. Just FYI in the process...
Capt. Travis

Kevin Morin
Posts: 739
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 11:36 am
Location: Kenai, Alaska

Re: question on scooter boat build

Post by Kevin Morin » Wed Mar 30, 2016 3:02 pm

Travis, I'm working on a hull update in metal for the Scooter design.

I'll need a few clear statements about your build circumstances - please let me know with Yes and No to the following?

Do you have access to 20' sheets AND a 20 bed brake?
OR
Will the hull sheets be in 12' lengths (12' and 20' sheets and brake beds are the only ones I've actually seen)
If there are other circumstances with your hull I'd need to know that in clearly stated " I will buy X' length sheets and bend them in an Y' Length brake."

Now I need some fixed numbers; exact figures- no maybe's- please!

What is the bend radius planned by whatever service you will be using, and confirm that you're planning to use 5052- (and please see if you can confirm the H-series of the supplied sheets?)

I realize that we've talked 15'-9", now 18' and also 20' LOA; if you have the choice please give me the LOA that is most desirable? I'm voting for 20'LOA due to the wheel chair access conditions you plan to support- the bigger the better regarding stability and room, but its your call.

I'm planning to make the boat proportionally larger- that is 15'-9" becomes 20' LOA x 8'6" or close thereabouts?
I'd like to confirm hard numbers- not my reasoning but yours. Please state the final LOA x BOA; the depth would be 15" if the size were scaled up evenly. This puts the bow out of the water a bit more, gives a taller bow deck locker/platform and generally increases the entire design to a bigger hull.

I think it will travel about the same speed due to the added flotation in the bigger hulls but the wt. increase will slow down the boat a few miles and hour top end. But, the increase will haul much more 30% to 40% more and that will give you a more stable boating platform for those who are physically challenged.

I'm working on the design now, and will show some images of the plans process shortly. (I) Would like to have some fixed, firm, and not negotiable sizes/dims to draw. I'd like you to consider looking up the max highway beam of a permit load -but not the pilot car width of a load/boat. We stretch to 8'6" usually to get the biggest boat that will haul without a pilot car, then we can just hand a wide load sign from the stern and go where you want? That's Alaska, not many people, fewer cops, fewer reg.s and not your state.

Thanks for your patience,

cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
Kevin Morin

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